Bengals trade CB David Jones to Jax for S Reggie Nelson

[HoosierCat]

Nelson has certainly dropped in the last couple of yrs. Not to say he's bad at all. In fact, he entered the league and started making plays almost immediately.

And I think it's worth noting that that was when the Jags still had a pretty good D. In '06, the year before he joined, they were second in the NFL. His rookie (and best) year they were 12. Since then they've fallen to 17 and last year, 23.

That suggests to me that if given a clear role (and I agree with Hair,

is it) in a good defense (which we have) then hoping for him to bounce back isn't irrational.

[JoeMama]

The only difference between myself and popular opinion here is that I think Reggie Nelson's chances of being reformed into a good safety are significantly lower than conventional thought.

That is all.

I make evaluations like this on a player by player basis. I know I wasn't here when Benson and Jones were signed, but I thought both were good pickups at the time.

I don't have a one-size-fits-all attitude toward underachievers.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

And I think it's worth noting that that was when the Jags still had a pretty good D. In '06, the year before he joined, they were second in the NFL. His rookie (and best) year they were 12. Since then they've fallen to 17 and last year, 23.

And their drop is so precipitous that I'm reasonably willing to write off his drop in production as growing dysfunction - clearly, there's more than him at fault. I believe one of the things that really downgraded was their D-line, which was once very good. If Nelson was in a situation where he was not just having to play centerfield by himself but practically the whole outfield (thanks to diminished pass rush), struggling wouldn't be a surprise.

Also, in terms of the (very apt) Zimmer as Dave Duncan theory - I'm most likely to buy that on teams in a little disarray, that don't have a record of developing raw talent. I can see JAX cast in that role.

I'm just glad to have some speed back there. I'm very optimistic on it. Hell, I think I'm almost as glad to see the last of Davey Jones.

[Kazkal]

The only difference between myself and popular opinion here is that I think Reggie Nelson's chances of being reformed into a good safety are significantly lower than conventional thought.

That is all.

I make evaluations like this on a player by player basis. I know I wasn't here when Benson and Jones were signed, but I thought both were good pickups at the time.

I don't have a one-size-fits-all attitude toward underachievers.

MJ was labeled underachiever in college so was Dunlap,So far I'm quite happy with both of those players...You have to factor in circumstances sometimes Nelson May still be a crappy player 2 years from now...Or he may have just been in the wrong system without right people lighting a fire under his asss..no one knows but Marvin & Zimmer thought he was worth grabbing and not risking letting him hit the waivers...

[TJJackson]

The only difference between myself and popular opinion here is that I think Reggie Nelson's chances of being reformed into a good safety are significantly lower than conventional thought.

That is all.

Well, at least you give it a chance. I dont think the player we gave up had a chance of becoming a good corner. Average, perhaps. Good, no.

So thats good

In the meantime, while he learns our defense, his speed (4.35 pre-draft) and agressiveness will be harnessed on special teams. Do you think he will have an impact on special teams?

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Well, at least you give it a chance. I dont think the player we gave up had a chance of becoming a good corner. Average, perhaps. Good, no.

Davey Jones was also just getting buried on the depth chart. He'll definitely get a better chance to play in JAX.

[HairOnFire]

The only difference between myself and popular opinion here is that I think Reggie Nelson's chances of being reformed into a good safety are significantly lower than conventional thought.

At this point conventional thought has already gone out the window. Because conventional thought starts with the Bengals addressing their need for a young safety prospect early in the last draft. Instead, they didn't draft one at all, focusing on other needs. Thus, the only young safety prospect added, Jeremy Miles, was an undrafted FA. He's now stashed on the practice squad along with another undrafted FA, Rico Murray, who was picked up last year. Obviously, neither player was deemed ready to play. And neither was in a position to until veteran FA pickup Gibril Wilson suffered a season ending injury....thereby creating anew the need for a veteran safety with playing experience. Nelson gives them that, and youth.

Frankly, this move seems no different than the Ravens recent trade for a marginal starting CB tossed aside by Seattle. Both are 11th hour trades featuring disappointing young starters who no longer fit in their old teams plans, but can give their new teams the snaps they had previously neglected to fill earlier....inpart because the team failed to address at least one significant need on draft day. And there's the proverbial rub because neither move has to be brilliant. Because at this point, this late, just average or even slightly mediocre would be a tremendous help.

[TJJackson]

Both are 11th hour trades featuring disappointing young starters who no longer fit in their old teams plans, but can give their new teams the snaps they had previously neglected to fill earlier....inpart because the team failed to address at least one significant need on draft day. And there's the proverbial rub because neither move has to be brilliant. Because at this point, this late, just average or even slightly mediocre would be a tremendous help.

To be fair, no team knows in April what injuries they will see in July-August, so it's not possible to know for sure if you've picked up enough players at the right positions to cover such eventualities. You lose a player to injury, you go pick up a replacement. It's business as usual.

That said, two of the three main criticisms I had of this year's draft was the fact that they did not pick up a versatile safety or a QB to develop, and seemingly with these last two moves they have done just that. I also wondered why they didn't pick up a young bellcow running back but maybe they thought Brian Leonard (who has the prototypical size if not the health history to be such a back) was going to be their number 2 power back.

[Sea Ray]

I also wondered why they didn't pick up a young bellcow running back but maybe they thought Brian Leonard (who has the prototypical size if not the health history to be such a back) was going to be their number 2 power back.

I think Peerman could be that guy. Maybe they lucked into him but I think he has the skills to be the 1st and 2nd down back if Benson goes down.

[TJJackson]

I also wondered why they didn't pick up a young bellcow running back but maybe they thought Brian Leonard (who has the prototypical size if not the health history to be such a back) was going to be their number 2 power back.

I think Peerman could be that guy. Maybe they lucked into him but I think he has the skills to be the 1st and 2nd down back if Benson goes down.

Peerman's a little lighter - sorta a Kenny Watson sized guy - roughly 212 pounds.

[Kazkal]

I also wondered why they didn't pick up a young bellcow running back but maybe they thought Brian Leonard (who has the prototypical size if not the health history to be such a back) was going to be their number 2 power back.

I think Peerman could be that guy. Maybe they lucked into him but I think he has the skills to be the 1st and 2nd down back if Benson goes down.

Peerman's a little lighter - sorta a Kenny Watson sized guy - roughly 212 pounds.

Yes but he's also only 5'9

[Trevor]

Peerman wont be on this team when leanard comes back,.. P.S sure but i think we get someone back maybe coffman idk,..

[Sea Ray]

Peerman wont be on this team when leanard comes back,.. P.S sure but i think we get someone back maybe coffman idk,..

I doubt that will have anything to do with it. They don't see Leonard as a Benson replacement. His role is totally different. He's still on the roster so his "coming back" won't necessitate a roster move

[Trevor]

Peerman wont be on this team when leanard comes back,.. P.S sure but i think we get someone back maybe coffman idk,..

I doubt that will have anything to do with it. They don't see Leonard as a Benson replacement. His role is totally different. He's still on the roster so his "coming back" won't necessitate a roster move

But he probably wont play til carolina,.. Then peerman will be obsolete except on special teams,.. We have enough special teams guys,.. He's good don't get me wrong,.. But if we pick up a true fullback,.. he's gone

[Sea Ray]

But he probably wont play til carolina,.. Then peerman will be obsolete except on special teams,.. We have enough special teams guys,.. He's good don't get me wrong,.. But if we pick up a true fullback,.. he's gone

If we pickup a true FB, then yes, but that isn't Leonard

[whizzo]

don't mind me, just pimping Owen Schmitt...

[TJJackson]

After one game, your special teams tackling leader is.........

[Sea Ray]

After one game, your special teams tackling leader is.........

Were there any tackles made on special teams yesterday? I didn't notice too many

[Walrus]

After one game, your special teams tackling leader is.........

Were there any tackles made on special teams yesterday? I didn't notice too many

I was looking for info on this and thought about starting a seperate thread about sp teams. Anyone else missing Hebert, Jeanty and Hodge right about now?

[TJJackson]

and Purify