Palmer must improve

[GoBengals!]

How long can we wait for Palmer? 6 years as a starter, two playoff appearances and no playoff wins... Though the team’s woes don’t fall all on Palmer's shoulders, but he should carry most of the blame. Should we bring in some competition at QB to light a fire under Palmer to perform better? Has it been the lack of receivers? Your thoughts?

/>http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5067616

[BengalPimp]

How long can we wait for Palmer? 6 years as a starter, two playoff appearances and no playoff wins... Though the team's woes don't fall all on Palmer's shoulders, but he should carry most of the blame. Should we bring in some competition at QB to light a fire under Palmer to perform better? Has it been the lack of receivers? Your thoughts?

http://sports.espn.g...tory?id=5067616

Enough of the blame has been put on Palmer already. Tell me a QB who would have put up great numbers with that sad bunch of WR's and no TE's? Add to that an O-Line that run-blocked, but looked very suspect in Pass protection.

I believe Palmer will have a great season, and return to Pro Bowl form. Let me tell you what I base that on. The Bengals have upgraded their WR position with the addition of Antonio Bryant. He will be the big play threat we didn't have last season. They will definitely do something at the TE position, through the draft/development of Coffman/possible re-signing of Kelly. The O-Line will have a season under their belt of playing together, and I have to believe they will work hard to improve during training camp and pre-season. Andre Smith will be a starter the whole season, that in itself is an upgrade over Collins and Roland.

.......AND The thing that nobody ever talks about, but I think will be night and day from last season......Carson Palmer's LEFT HAND ! It was damn near impossible for Palmer to effectively sell the Play-Action while handing off with his right/throwing hand...Nowhere to hide the ball !!!! With a strong running game, better receivers, and a healed left hand, look for a big season.

[ArmyBengal]

Yep, can't support the "Blame Carson" thought process right now. He's been the leader everyone thought he wasn't coming out of college and has had to put up with more than the average amount of sh*t from an organization that has been to stupid to get out of its own way for a very long time. Zimmer building a defense that can support and at times even win games takes some of the load off of Carson. The offense also shifting to a "run first" mentality also has to be taken into consideration.

Don't get me wrong, Carson needs to work on what I thought were more than the average of overthrown / underthrown balls, but then again decisions made at game speed are not always so appearant to the viewer. I think he comes back with a very strong season.

[BengalByTheBay]

Though the team’s woes don’t fall all on Palmer's shoulders, but he should carry most of the blame.

This seems to be inherently contradictory. I would guess a survey of opinion here would reveal that most of us believe Carson did not play as well as he could last season. However, to suggest bringing in competition for your consensus franchise QB seems .... wacko. What do you want to be, the Cleveland Browns? You can't just bring in somebody to "light a fire" under Carson Palmer. If you bring in any real competition, you are blowing up your fundamental offense and starting a terrible situation in which he will feel undermined and threatened. That's exactly the wrong thing to do unless you're ready to draft your future QB and move on. I don't think many, including me, are anywhere near that point.

[derekshank]

I saw a mock draft that had the Bengals using one of their two 4th round picks to draft Dan LeFevour.

While I disagree with the idea that the Bengals need to bring someone in to compete with Palmer, I certainy wouldn't mind using a pick on a capable backup in the event that Palmer gets hurt again. I don't see LeFevour as a legit NFL starter, but I think he could be coached up to be solid.

[kingwilly]

I think this is a make-break season for Palmer.

If he cannot progress in scoring points, and becoming more efficient, then it will be time to re-think the direction of the QB position.

Now that he has some new weapons, and will be behind a line that has every reason to play even better, my hope is that this team gets dangerous again in its ability to score in a variety of ways.

As it relates to the draft, I would be surprised if they took a QB. With JP and Jordan, it is not a real need. Some would say they could do without JP, move Jordan up and groom a young guy though I cannot see them burning anything sooner than r5 on a project QB, and the ones at that range are not the quality necessary. better to wait till 2011.

[HoosierCat]

Now that he has some new weapons,

What new weapons?

(And seriously, if you say Bryant and Matt "cokehead" Jones I will reach out of your screen and slap you silly.)

[derekshank]

Now that he has some new weapons,

What new weapons?

(And seriously, if you say Bryant and Matt "cokehead" Jones I will reach out of your screen and slap you silly.)

I was thinking the same thing.

I mean, yeah I think Antonio Bryant is an upgrade over Coles, but there is still no answer for the loss of Henry. This is still a running team, and the only thing that would make a significant change to that is Dez Bryant and a healthy Chase Coffman.

[Kazkal]

Well Coffman hopefully playing should be a weapon,Plus what ever players we draft in 2 weeks.

PS,Plus maybe that little light switch gets flipped on in Jerome Simpson head,Hmmm I think we could make sitcom out of that

[BengalPimp]

Now that he has some new weapons,

What new weapons?

(And seriously, if you say Bryant and Matt "cokehead" Jones I will reach out of your screen and slap you silly.)

Uh, I believe his nickname is "Coke Zero"

[HoosierCat]

Uh, I believe his nickname is "Coke Zero"

I stand corrected.

[BengalPimp]

, but there is still no answer for the loss of Henry.

Enough, I understand he passed away, but honestly we lost him back in '06.

His Stats the past 3 years ?

28 Games

52 Receptions

799 Yards

6 TD's

In the last 3 years man.....

Antonio Bryant will better all those numbers this year alone (in 16 games).

[ArmyBengal]

Now that he has some new weapons,

What new weapons?

(And seriously, if you say Bryant and Matt "cokehead" Jones I will reach out of your screen and slap you silly.)

Uh, I believe his nickname is "Coke Zero"

I second the submission of "Coke Zero" as Jones' new nickname from here on out.

Funny !!!

[HoosierCat]

Replacing Henry isn't half as important as the other wide receiver we didn't have last year.

The No. 1 reason in my book why the 2009 Cincinnati Bengals fouled out in the first round of the playoffs is T.J. spurning the team for Seattle.

Heaven knows I have my issues with Houshmandzadeh, but he and Carson and Chad had something special going. And those kind of combos don't just grow on trees.

I look at our WR corps right now and I don't see a damn thing to scare any defensive coordinator we might face. (And let's not even start about the TE slot as regards the passing game.)

And short of some kind of crazy blockbuster trade for someone like Brandon Marshall, I don't see any way to change that right now. Even landing a guy like Dez Bryant probably doesn't change things this year, he'd need time to develop.

For me, the bottom line is that the team's biggest weakness is its passing game, and I don't think they've done bubkis to improve it. So when I see predictions that they won't even do as well in 2010 as they did in 2009, I find it hard to argue.

[derekshank]

, but there is still no answer for the loss of Henry.

Enough, I understand he passed away, but honestly we lost him back in '06.

His Stats the past 3 years ?

28 Games

52 Receptions

799 Yards

6 TD's

In the last 3 years man.....

Antonio Bryant will better all those numbers this year alone (in 16 games).

Maybe. I think so at least.

But that's neither here nor there.

My point is that there is currently no one on the roster to fill the role he played.

Has he been gone since '06? Sure. How has the passing game been going since then? There is very little chance of seeing this passing game go from terrible to good with the weapons on the roster right now. And that's my main point. There is still a hole in the passing game that has yet to be remedied - and no... I don't believe Matt Jones is an answer to any question worth asking.

[derekshank]

Even landing a guy like Dez Bryant probably doesn't change things this year, he'd need time to develop.

I disagree on this point.

Crabtree held out for all of training camp and several games into the season. He played in the last 11 games and managed 48 catches for 625 yards. And that was with no other real receiving weapons around him and a bad QB.

Dez Bryant would be the 3rd WR behind Chad and Antonio, and there would be incredible mismatches to be made there. I think he has the natural talent to improve the passing game immediately... and he wouldn't really even have to come in and set the world on fire. Just his presence should open things up. But hey, agree to disagree. That, and I don't see Dez Bryant being a Bengal.

[HoosierCat]

Even landing a guy like Dez Bryant probably doesn't change things this year, he'd need time to develop.

I disagree on this point.

That's fine. That's why I qualified my comment with "probably." It's possible Dez (or any other WR the Bengals take in the opening rounds) will make a significant impact this season, but the odds are against it. And many years of following the Bengals have made me very, very, very leery of expecting miracles in the draft.

[Trevor]

Even landing a guy like Dez Bryant probably doesn't change things this year, he'd need time to develop.

I disagree on this point.

That's fine. That's why I qualified my comment with "probably." It's possible Dez (or any other WR the Bengals take in the opening rounds) will make a significant impact this season, but the odds are against it. And many years of following the Bengals have made me very, very, very leery of expecting miracles in the draft.

I think you will all be pleasantly surprised with matt jones this year.

[James_Brooks21]

Now that he has some new weapons,

What new weapons?

(And seriously, if you say Bryant and Matt "cokehead" Jones I will reach out of your screen and slap you silly.)

Bryant is a weapon, not to disrespect the late Chris Henry but Antonio Bryant is a better player then Chris Henry. Bryant actually did something T.J. never did be a number one receiver without a lick of another decent receiver on the roster. I live in Tampa and I have watched Bryant in every game he played in as a Buc. Antonio Bryant was getting the number one cornerback and double coverage without a true number two receiver or decent quarterback on the team. Say what you want but it would not have been very many receivers in the league putting up the numbers he did in the situation he was in. Yes he had an off year last year but honestly he did the best he could in the situation that he was in with a horrible offensive line and a rookie quarterback. If he can stay healthy next year watch out with him having a good quarterback and a number one receiver on the other side. In two weeks we should have another weapon to open up things even more for Bryant.

[derekshank]

Now that he has some new weapons,

What new weapons?

(And seriously, if you say Bryant and Matt "cokehead" Jones I will reach out of your screen and slap you silly.)

Bryant is a weapon, not to disrespect the late Chris Henry but Antonio Bryant is a better player then Chris Henry. Bryant actually did something T.J. never did be a number one receiver without a lick of another decent receiver on the roster. I live in Tampa and I have watched Bryant in every game he played in as a Buc. Antonio Bryant was getting the number one cornerback and double coverage without a true number two receiver or decent quarterback on the team. Say what you want but it would not have been very many receivers in the league putting up the numbers he did in the situation he was in. Yes he had an off year last year but honestly he did the best he could in the situation that he was in with a horrible offensive line and a rookie quarterback. If he can stay healthy next year watch out with him having a good quarterback and a number one receiver on the other side. In two weeks we should have another weapon to open up things even more for Bryant.

I hear you... and I agree with you. But I just don see Antonio Bryant being able to singlehandedly revive the passing game. I think Chad and Antonio is a far better duo than Chad and Coles last year, but that's not saying much... and without a #3 to really cause defenses trouble, I don't forsee a significant upgrade inte overall offensive numbers.

[HoosierCat]

Bryant is a weapon

I'll be happy to be wrong, but I'll believe it when I see it.

[kingwilly]

There are three players who could elevate this O to the level required to make it really better.

1. Marshall - He will be moved on or around draft day. Depending on how the front end of the draft goes, the Bengals could trade down with Denver, package Collins or Livings and bring in a serious weapon. It really does make sense, as Marshall and his problems fit SoP's character development profile. It also makes sense as he could easily fill the void left by TJ.

2. TO - His price will go down, though he could end up such a late edition that his impact may not be seen/felt until late season.

3. Dez Bryant - I think he could come right in and contribute the way Crabtree did once he signed. He is that good.

I think this team still needs one of the above, and even though I do not like TO and he would be my last choice, even he would put the WR corp over the top.

[HoosierCat]

I remain a huge fan of bringing in TO purely from an entertainment/meltdown standpoint. And what the hell, maybe he'd help.

If the Bengals trade for Marshall I will eat Hair's shorts.

If Dez is there at 21, I will cross my fingers and hope. (And yeah, I know, that and a couple bucks will get me a cuppa coffee.)

[kingwilly]

I remain a huge fan of bringing in TO purely from an entertainment/meltdown standpoint. And what the hell, maybe he'd help.

If the Bengals trade for Marshall I will eat Hair's shorts.

If Dez is there at 21, I will cross my fingers and hope. (And yeah, I know, that and a couple bucks will get me a cuppa coffee.)

Marshall can be had for our r1 pick, I am guessing straight up.

Paying him a new contract would be more than the contract of the 21st slot but I think it would be worth it. This lost some steam when they resigned Bobbie W, but I still think it is on the table. There will be some cuts, as a matter of budget balancing, and jetting the contracts of guys like Geathers, Simpson and not having Coles, Graham, Reggie Kelly or Utecht on the books should loosen things up.

SoP, make it happen.

[Kazkal]

That's fine. That's why I qualified my comment with "probably." It's possible Dez (or any other WR the Bengals take in the opening rounds) will make a significant impact this season, but the odds are against it. And many years of following the Bengals have made me very, very, very leery of expecting miracles in the draft.

Outside of Chris Perry selection what horrible picks have we had in the 1st round under Marvin lewis era?

-Carson Palmer

-Chris Perry (Injury Prone)

-David Pollack(Can't fault Front Office when a freak accident and player brakes his neck)

-Jonathan Joseph

-Leon Hall

-Keith Rivers

-Andre Smith (Some people will bitch but it's to early to bitch about him.)

Not that bad IMO when comes to first rounders 1 Bust and 1 freakish Career ending injury,It's the 2nd rounders that worry me

Rey Maualuga Stud Muffin who can hopefully keep himself out of trouble from here on out.

Jerome SImpson Bust

Kenny Irons Bust

Andrew Whitworth Franchise Linemen

Odell Thurman Bust

Keiwan Ratliff ,Madieu Williams One was burnt Toast and the Other had 4 solid years and gone

Eric Steinbach 4 Years and gone