Tight End in the First Round?

[7/11]

if we keep kelly, i'm good with him, foschi, and coffman.

if we lose reggie, i like mccoy, peek, and gronkowski.

[walzav29]

To me its obvious that a bad foot would hamper a rookie severely. On top of learning everything a rookie has to, having a bad wheel can't help. I think Chase is going to be good.

[Walrus]

You can argue both sides of this debate and be at least moderately correct.

We could use a TE based upon having so many question marks at the position, but then again, we already have a pass catching threat in Coffman that the coaches have continued to praise recently. I think people don't give enough credit to Foschi, who came out of nowhere and had a solid season last year. I compare the TE position simliar to the Center position heading into last years draft, where I would have bet a large amount of money they would have drafted center higher. The coaches felt we had the answer on the roster in Cook and waited until later to take Luigs. I think the coaches like what they see out of Coffman and are hpoing all is well with the injury heading into this season.

That being said, I think they wait until at least the 4th before taking a TE, but do agree with the thought of taking one.

The Bengals have been trying to shore up the position for quite some time, but I just don't see how a rookie TE is going to have the impact the team needs at this point, when they have been so wishy washy with how they utilize the position.

I still like Pitta out of BYU and think he would pair up nicely with Coffman in two TE sets.

Foschi did ok -- considering where we picked him up and the performance of the guy he replaced (*cough*coats*cough*) -- but he performed statistically at the bottom of the league. He's hopefully keeping the seat warm until someone better comes along. Coffman may have been great in college, but a lot can change -- there's no guarantee he can even make it out of the gates yet. With all our chips down on him, if Coffman tanks our passing game will continue to struggle.

We need more at this position. First round pick? I don't watch much college ball and I'm no scout so I'll leave that call to those of you who know better. It sounds like Gresham might be available and he seems like a consensus 1st round talent. I like most of what I've heard about Hernandez as well -- if he's there in the second he looks pretty good to me. I appreciate some of the suggestions of mid-round talent that might be out there. I will be disappointed if we don't address this spot either with a solid FA or with a high- to mid-draft pick.

I suspect a lot of people on here are needlessly cynical about Brat's ability to effectively utilize the position and are thus inclined to dismiss any attempt to improve as useless. I'm not an apologist for all things Brat, but in this case we just haven't had much going for us talent-wise.

[Walrus]

I don't think anybody forgot how productive Coffman was in college....It's just that....that was college.

This argument makes no sense. So you're dismissing what Coffman can do just because what he did happened in college, yet at the same time advocating that we take Gresham based on......what he did in college.

Coffman has had a year in this offense and should be 100% by the time training camp starts. I just don't see taking another high round TE until we know what the one we have can do. If Coffman doesn't pan out this year, we still have Foschi who can play capably and then we can draft one next year if needed. Based on Marvin's comments about Coffman the other day, I just don't see Coffman being a bust.

My doubts about Coffman have more to do with how he did in camp last year and the way he was struggling to pick things out. If he had been lighting it up before he got injured, I would feel differently now. If he had pushed for playing time when he was healthy and we were lacking playmakers, I would feel differently.

[Walrus]

if we keep kelly, i'm good with him, foschi, and coffman.

if we lose reggie, i like mccoy, peek, and gronkowski.

Oh yeah -- I hope we don't try to bring Kelly back. He's old and his skills were declining even before his MAJOR injury. It's unfortunate because he is a great guy but I really don't think he'll be able to come back and be the blocking monster he once was.

[Dadraftnick]

IMO first round picks should be used on.- in this order( in other words if you have a QB and not LT then, you take a LT)

QB- the most important guy on the field

LT- the guy that protects the QB's blind side

DE- the guy that takes out the other teams QB

DT- the guy that stops the other teams running game

CB- at least one CB should be a shut down cornner while you dont have to have a 1st round pick to get a good CB , I dont have a problem drafting one if the other spots are filled.

Sometimes-if you have all of the other spots filled.

RB- If you draft a RB he better be special, a guy that can carry a team , because most of the time drafts are loaded through all 7 rounds with guys that can start at the RB spot and 1st round RB's have a high bust %

WR- If the guy is special and you have the other spots filled and the guy brings super skills but, as a rule 1st round WR's have a high bust% and you can find a starting quality WR in all 7 rounds.

I would not use a 1st round pick on a TE , if I need to have one bad I would go to free agency because, free agent TE's usualy go pretty cheap, compaired to other spots.

The guys that go in the early rounds usualy cant block, very few TE's are complete when they come into the draft.

That is why you get a free agent, they are fairly cheap and they can block and catch.

If we use a 1st round pick on a TE , three of the top 4 TE 's are injuried we could be in the same place we are with Chase Coffman ( the guy not being ready for a year or not be able to block for a year)

If Coffman had not been injuried his Senior year he could have been a 1st round pick at TE, he set a NCAA TE record for most catches 247 and won the Mackey award several years.

I still think that Coffman will contribute to the Bengals.

[Kazkal]

Foschi did ok -- considering where we picked him up and the performance of the guy he replaced (*cough*coats*cough*) -- but he performed statistically at the bottom of the league

He also wasn't starting until what week 7? on top sharing times with coats who was still used as blocking TE and OT's in jumbo packages so shouldn't be surprising hes not in top half of the TE's or hell at the bottom

That is why you get a free agent, they are fairly cheap and they can block and catch.

Exactly theres some more then servicable vet TIght Ends out there that would be exactly what we need,Then if they Still feel they need depth they can look in the mid to later rounds.

PS,SO Draft you don't think Getting a Ed Reed or Sean Taylor type safety is justified by using a 1st? I dunno for me it's not about position but simply the player "shrug" I could justify spending a 1st on anything besides K,LS & P if its for a special player.

[ArmyBengal]

To start, there are no guarantees on ANY draft pick, so there's no reason to make that a reason to "not" take any player regardless of position. Next, I have no doubt that Brat has been trying to improve the TE position, but will not listen to arguments that this offense can't be lethal without that "complete" TE. They had TE's that were scripting plays when Carson was throwing for over 4000 yards on the season and had one of the top passing offenses in the league. It boils down to play makers and being able to pass protect. I will still argue with anyone who was over the top satisfied with the pass protecting effort shown by this o-line last year. It's also the exact reason many predict the Bengals are going to take a Guard early as well. The interior of the o-line should be addressed. The question is when ??

[redsbengalsbucks]

To start, there are no guarantees on ANY draft pick, so there's no reason to make that a reason to "not" take any player regardless of position. Next, I have no doubt that Brat has been trying to improve the TE position, but will not listen to arguments that this offense can't be lethal without that "complete" TE. They had TE's that were scripting plays when Carson was throwing for over 4000 yards on the season and had one of the top passing offenses in the league. It boils down to play makers and being able to pass protect. I will still argue with anyone who was over the top satisfied with the pass protecting effort shown by this o-line last year. It's also the exact reason many predict the Bengals are going to take a Guard early as well. The interior of the o-line should be addressed. The question is when ??

I'm hoping the answer is the first round. The passing game will be much improved if Palmer has a few more seconds to find an open guy.

[Ickey44]

I don't think anybody forgot how productive Coffman was in college....It's just that....that was college.

This argument makes no sense. So you're dismissing what Coffman can do just because what he did happened in college, yet at the same time advocating that we take Gresham based on......what he did in college.

Coffman has had a year in this offense and should be 100% by the time training camp starts. I just don't see taking another high round TE until we know what the one we have can do. If Coffman doesn't pan out this year, we still have Foschi who can play capably and then we can draft one next year if needed. Based on Marvin's comments about Coffman the other day, I just don't see Coffman being a bust.

My doubts about Coffman have more to do with how he did in camp last year and the way he was struggling to pick things out. If he had been lighting it up before he got injured, I would feel differently now. If he had pushed for playing time when he was healthy and we were lacking playmakers, I would feel differently.

Well, there's two things to consider there. First, that was his first NFL camp and he's just learning the playbook. Second, he wasn't healthy at all last year, which is why he ultimately ended up on IR.

Should he come back healthy this year, I don't see a reason to be worried. He's had a year to learn the playbook.

Also, in regards to Foschi, I don't put much stock on the amount of catches he had or didn't have. In Brat's offense the TE never gets many catches. Foschi caught almost every ball thrown his way last year and blocked fairly well, too.

[HAPPYJAQ]

Although I still don't believe the Bengals should take a TE in the First, I'm starting to come around to the thinking that Coffman deserves another year to prove himself before another TE is selected high. In reality, the negatives on Coffman are that his blocking needs work and that he's suffered through some injuries that have taken him off the football field. The positives are that he's an exceptional receiving threat for the position and should be an instant factor in the red zone. In those cases, how is he any different that the best TE in THIS year's draft??

I don't think Gresham is a receiver in the Tony Gonzalez or Kellen Winslow II mold, who are both exceptionally athletic. Hell, he's probably slightly less athletic than either Martellus Bennett or Jermichael Finley.

I see Greshem is a cross between a Ben Watson and Tony Sheffler. Just athletic enough to make some plays in the passing game, but nowhere near the top of the grid for the TE position. It would take an offense different from the Bengals to get the most out of Greshem (or even Hernandez, who's probably more of an H-back/FB).

Wouldn't surprise me a bit to see the best TE in this draft to drop into the middle of Round 2, especially if he can't run better than a 4.75 this week. He's much less complete player than Brandon Pettrigrew, who went #20 to the Lions after running in the 4.85 neighborhood. The difference is, Pettigrew is a much better blocker and had limited or no injury concerns entering the draft.

[HairOnFire]

A very interesting twit from JP Foschi's agent, Ralph Cindrich....

JP Foschi #Cincinnati Bengals starting #NFL TE will become a #free agent. Marv Lewis left a message asking JP to keep them informed.

about 2 hours ago via web

/>http://twitter.com/RalphCindrich

[HoosierCat]

A very interesting twit from JP Foschi's agent, Ralph Cindrich....

JP Foschi #Cincinnati Bengals starting #NFL TE will become a #free agent. Marv Lewis left a message asking JP to keep them informed.

about 2 hours ago via web

/>http://twitter.com/RalphCindrich

Sounds like the usual Bengals "let the market set his value and then decide whether to match" strategy, just like they did with Glenn Holt.

[Kazkal]

A very interesting twit from JP Foschi's agent, Ralph Cindrich....

JP Foschi #Cincinnati Bengals starting #NFL TE will become a #free agent. Marv Lewis left a message asking JP to keep them informed.

about 2 hours ago via web

/>http://twitter.com/RalphCindrich

That's suprising since he's RFA figure he'd atleast get the smallest tender giving them chance to match

[BengalPimp]

how is he any different that the best TE in THIS year's draft??

Because the Best TE in this year's draft will more than likely play at least 1 snap this season.......Seriously guys, I like Chase Coffman, and was happy when they drafted him..BUT THE GUY DIDNT PLAY AT ALL LAST YEAR...Here's my point, I don't think we should give up on him, but he hasn't been healthy yet, AND he's the ONLY TE under contract.

[BengalPimp]

I don't think Gresham is a receiver in the Tony Gonzalez or Kellen Winslow II mold, who are both exceptionally athletic. Hell, he's probably slightly less athletic than either Martellus Bennett or Jermichael Finley.

I see Greshem is a cross between a Ben Watson and Tony Sheffler. Just athletic enough to make some plays in the passing game, but nowhere near the top of the grid for the TE position.

What??? not athletic??? I guess you know more than any of the scouts, and the Tony Gonzalez comparisons (which you say he's nothing like) and that the consensus was that he would have been a Top 15 pick had he come out last year....And sorry, but you lost all credibility with the "cross between Ben Watson and Tony Sheffler" comment. Seriously HappyJaq ? Seriously?

[BengalPimp]

It really surprises me how many people think you can just go pick up a quality TE in free-agency. If that's the case, why haven't we done that? (Utecht was not quality by the way). You need to understand that teams don't let good TE go...It's just that simple !!! TE's do not command as big contracts as other positions, so a team will pay to keep a good one. One they probably used a 1st Round pick on...

Look, you can't count on free-agency, Coffman is the only TE under contract...Foschi is not ! Coffman hasn't played a snap yet, and even if we re-sign Foschi, he strikes fear in absolutely no one!!! We need help at the position, we CANNOT have a repeat of last year. If Coffman can't play TODAY...Do you realize we would have ZERO TE's on our roster?

Gresham is a beast, and I'll be saying that all next season, whoever he plays for (hopefully us).

[BengalszoneBilly]

Look, you can't count on free-agency

Would you agree that free agency gives you a somewhat better idea of what you're getting than does the draft? I mean with free agency, you've already seen how the player performs at the NFL level, at least for a few years.

[Kazkal]

Look, you can't count on free-agency

But we can count on the Draft? POllack?Odell? Irons? C.Perry?

Defensive Free Agent Starters

Odom

Tank

B.Johnson (Okay he was a backup b ut also our best Linebacker last year)

Dhani

Crocker

Roy Williams (Only 3 games but still out played Ndukwe in em)

So I'd say can count on Free Agents but you do have your chances of missing on them just like the draft (cough utecht cough Coles)

[BengalPimp]

Look, you can't count on free-agency

Would you agree that free agency gives you a somewhat better idea of what you're getting than does the draft? I mean with free agency, you've already seen how the player performs at the NFL level, at least for a few years.

Let me clarify...You can't count on free agency for the TE position....How many "top" TE's have made it to free-agency? How many are with the team that drafted them? Witten, Gates, Clark, Todd Heap, Brent Celek, Vernon Davis, Heath Miller, Zach Miller, Owen Daniels, Greg Olsen....thats 10 count 'em 10 of the top TE's that have played their entire career with the same team....3 others, Tony Gonzalez, Jeremy Shockey, Kellen Winslow, were never allowed to test the free-agent market either, they were all traded!!!

AGAIN, Above is the proof...TOP TE's DON'T HIT THE FREE-AGENT MARKET.....Unless they're washed up...

[HairOnFire]

A very interesting twit from JP Foschi's agent, Ralph Cindrich....

JP Foschi #Cincinnati Bengals starting #NFL TE will become a #free agent. Marv Lewis left a message asking JP to keep them informed.

about 2 hours ago via web

/>http://twitter.com/RalphCindrich

Sounds like the usual Bengals "let the market set his value and then decide whether to match" strategy, just like they did with Glenn Holt.

Exactly. And who does Glenn Holt play for now?

Somebody else, right?

[HoosierCat]

A very interesting twit from JP Foschi's agent, Ralph Cindrich....

JP Foschi #Cincinnati Bengals starting #NFL TE will become a #free agent. Marv Lewis left a message asking JP to keep them informed.

about 2 hours ago via web

/>http://twitter.com/RalphCindrich

Sounds like the usual Bengals "let the market set his value and then decide whether to match" strategy, just like they did with Glenn Holt.

Exactly. And who does Glenn Holt play for now?

Somebody else, right?

Yup. The move just tells me what both you and I already knew, namely that the Bengals are (still) looking to upgrade at TE. If they don't do something big about the position in FA or via trade (and I doubt they'll be able to), then you can probably count on a TE in the first two rounds.