Leon Hall ranked as 2nd best CB in NFL

[Mr_Kennedy]

Stats

[BengalszoneBilly]

Stats

Welcome to Bengalszone Mr. Kennedy.

[JoePong]

I rank him as the 2nd best CB on his own team.

[cincyhokie]

I rank him as the 2nd best CB on his own team.

I have to agree with you there. Joseph is better.

However, the stats say something about his potential and with a CB just finishing up his 3rd year in the league you know he's going to get even better.

[BengalPimp]

I rank him as the 2nd best CB on his own team.

You also rank yourself as the #1 Begals fan....So that says something about your rankings.

Leon Hall is better than J Joe....They're both very good, and here's hoping we retain both, with their contracts being up in the next year or two, but if we could only keep one....I'd rather pay Hall.

[jjakq27]

Maybe this is being overly critical but he gave up some big plays in some big games this year. He's been around for awhile and I am a little tired of these post-game and Monday morning "I'll learn from my mistakes and promise to do better next time" statements.

Also on the flip-side of the stats, I'd be interested to compare our receiving corps and Chad to see how well they did against the guys on the list this year.

[Kazkal]

Depends I think Joseph is better when comes to Coverage because of his natural athleticism,But I think Hall is more Balanced...

[wpeldios]

You can't complain about either corner. Joseph does make more big plays, but also gets picked on a bit more. Honestly I thought both played like pro bowlers this year, but if I had to pick one, I'd go with Hall in a close one.

[Kazkal]

Joseph didn't get picked on that much few games earlier in the season but he also seems to play much closer to the line then Leon Does...

But Agreed can't complain about having either and I hope they Extend them both...Something Joseph & Hall deserve some credit for to Most other teams with good corners seemed to have much better passrush then we do...Sure we racked okay in sack number but Alot of those sacks were from great pass protection...Picture if we could get a Elvis Dubervill or Robert Mathis to pair with MJ on Passing downs.

[HoosierCat]

You can't complain about either corner. Joseph does make more big plays, but also gets picked on a bit more. Honestly I thought both played like pro bowlers this year, but if I had to pick one, I'd go with Hall in a close one.

Same here.

[HAPPYJAQ]

It's close, but I'd go with J-Jo. Hall has slightly surer hands, but has very suspect deep speed, and that was pretty much the knock on him coming out. He's easier to expose than Joseph is (San Diego). I actually think Leon would be a much better true Cover 2 CB than he is in the current Bengals defensive scheme.

I think Joseph has all the tools to be a top-flight shutdown CB and even Hall raves at how intelligent he is diagnosing plays. In becoming a surer tackler, the only other hole left in his game is making the easy interceptions, which was his knock coming from South Carolina. His hands have improved dramatically from his first couple of seasons, though.

I think the Bengals like what they have in Morgan Trent and Joseph will be the priority in re-signing. Trent hit the wall late in the year, but he looks like he'll be a pretty good cover CB in his own right. I believe he and MJ will make the greatest improvement in their games in '10.

[Kazkal]

Another thing love about our corners (Jjoe showed alot of this year) is their Nasty,Jjoe locking up with Hines and he layed the wood on some of hardest hits by the bengals this season...

You can't complain about either corner. Joseph does make more big plays, but also gets picked on a bit more.

Wanted to bring this up because really unfair IMO Yes early on seemed like Jjoe was one getting picked on but really i'd say they got picked on about same Jjoe alittle earlier in the season and then Hall alittle later.

I think the Bengals like what they have in Morgan Trent and Joseph will be the priority in re-signing. Trent hit the wall late in the year, but he looks like he'll be a pretty good cover CB in his own right. I believe he and MJ will make the greatest improvement in their games in '10.

I think Morgan did a great job to he got burnt on a few plays,But that's going to happen he's a rookie and a 6th round at that...Even some 1st round CB's give up plays their rookie year...Hell During the Raiders game we had 0 passrush it was really pathetic

[HairOnFire]

He's [Hall] easier to expose than Joseph is (San Diego).

Tell that to Kevin Walter and the Houston Texans.

[HAPPYJAQ]

He's [Hall] easier to expose than Joseph is (San Diego).

Tell that to Kevin Walter and the Houston Texans.

I think that J-Jo was still nursing that foot in '08. This past season was his first fully healthy season since his rookie year, on his own acknoledgement.

I just think that Joseph is steadier. What makes him great is that he has tremendous make-up speed, which allows him to make or play on the ball or make a quick tackle, even on plays in which he's out of position. I've watched plenty of games in which Leon was burnt deep and either the receiver didn't come up with the catch or the ball pass was not on target, although I believe Hall is a better tackler and better on the short-to-intermediate routes. I say keep an eye on Trent, who has all of the measurables, but only needs more experience. We're very solid at CB, if you consider that David Jones, who will be better in '10 than he was in '08, when he showed some flashes in coming to the Bengals the week before the season started from New Orleans.

I think Leon would be sensational as a FS in this defense, but he'll probably only be a #2 CB or #1B (at best) in this league, based on his vulnerability on long passes due to only average speed for the position. Consider Hall a "poor man's" Ty Law, in his prime.

[HairOnFire]

He's [Hall] easier to expose than Joseph is (San Diego).

Tell that to Kevin Walter and the Houston Texans.

I think that J-Jo was still nursing that foot in '08.

Perhaps, but it was Joseph's lack of concentration and mental errors over a multi-game span that prompted open criticism from Kevin Coyle and Marvin Lewis, with the latter calling Joseph's failure to tackle KW one of the worst plays he's ever seen in the NFL.

I think Leon would be sensational as a FS in this defense, but he'll probably only be a #2 CB or #1B (at best) in this league, based on his vulnerability on long passes due to only average speed for the position.

I'm willing to bet Hall matches up with opposing teams top wideout more often than Joseph...with the latter getting the call only when pure speed trumps all other concerns.

[Ickey44]

Also, if he's a 1A, he makes that play in Week 1 against Brandon Marshall at a clutch moment.

He did make that play, another receiver just happened to be in the vicinity to catch the deflection uncontested.

[BengalPimp]

Consider Hall a "poor man's" Ty Law, in his prime.

Since you're playing let's compare Michigan CB's, why not say Morgan Trent is a "Poor Man's" Leon Hall...All 3 are Michigan Alumnus.

Truth is, Ty Law was a mixed-bag...He had some really good seasons mixed in with some mediocre ones....We have not seen that from Leon yet, just steady improvement so far....

[BengalPimp]

Here's a stat for you guys.....

Joseph = 4 seasons and 11 INT's

Hall = 3 seasons and 14 INT's

hmmm....

[HAPPYJAQ]

He's [Hall] easier to expose than Joseph is (San Diego).

Tell that to Kevin Walter and the Houston Texans.

I think that J-Jo was still nursing that foot in '08.

Perhaps, but it was Joseph's lack of concentration and mental errors over a multi-game span that prompted open criticism from Kevin Coyle and Marvin Lewis, with the latter calling Joseph's failure to tackle KW one of the worst plays he's ever seen in the NFL.

I think Leon would be sensational as a FS in this defense, but he'll probably only be a #2 CB or #1B (at best) in this league, based on his vulnerability on long passes due to only average speed for the position.

I'm willing to bet Hall matches up with opposing teams top wideout more often than Joseph...with the latter getting the call only when pure speed trumps all other concerns.

Not to psychoanalyze, but I think that playing CB in the NFL is probably as mind-wrecking as playing QB. That's the reason that you typically don't see the better CBs in the league perform well until their 3rd year or later in the league.

That said, the errors you referenced by Joseph in that year were well noted as concentration or mental errors, and not so much errors in which he was simply physically overmatched.

I'll agree that Hall does match up the the other teams key WR very well, at many times. That's why I'd give thought to considering him a 1B type CB. He's also maybe a 1B because he dominates the guys who are as physically talented (or less), than he is. The more talented WRs continue to give him trouble in man-to-man coverage. Also, if he's a 1A, he makes that play in Week 1 against Brandon Marshall at a clutch moment.

[HAPPYJAQ]

Consider Hall a "poor man's" Ty Law, in his prime.

Since you're playing let's compare Michigan CB's, why not say Morgan Trent is a "Poor Man's" Leon Hall...All 3 are Michigan Alumnus.

Truth is, Ty Law was a mixed-bag...He had some really good seasons mixed in with some mediocre ones....We have not seen that from Leon yet, just steady improvement so far....

Great point, but I'll say that Trent is the most athletic of the trio. I also went back and did some additional research, and he did an outstanding job shutting down some of the better players in college his Junior and Senior season. I understand that both Law and Hall both had better careers at Michigan as a CB, but also keep in mind, that Trent made the transition to CB his Sophomore year there, while the others were true CBs. The same could be said of Chinny Ndukwe, who actually has played better in the NFL as a FS/SS, than he ever did in college.

As far as Law goes, I'll agree he was a mixed bag. My point is, Law at his best was a fringe Pro Bowler, at a time in which nominations to that game were relevant. Leon has a chance to reach that same level of play, but I never see him being in the class where Champ or Revis are, who have the same physical skillset as Joseph, IMO.

[Kazkal]

Here's a stat for you guys.....

Joseph = 4 seasons and 11 INT's

Hall = 3 seasons and 14 INT's

hmmm....

Simply means Hall can hold on to a ball better

[Ickey44]

Here's a stat for you guys.....

Joseph = 4 seasons and 11 INT's

Hall = 3 seasons and 14 INT's

hmmm....

Simply means Hall can hold on to a ball better

True, Joseph has dropped A LOT of interceptions, especially in his rookie year.

[7/11]

they are different types of CB, but i take leon hall over jojo all day.

i do like me some leon, but 2nd-best is quite a stretch.

[redsbengalsbucks]

Here's a stat for you guys.....

Joseph = 4 seasons and 11 INT's

Hall = 3 seasons and 14 INT's

hmmm....

Simply means Hall can hold on to a ball better

Also means that Jjoe was hurt for a few of those games and had about 8 dropped INT's his first season. I'm to lazy to go find it, but I would like to see a comparison of Pass defended between the two of them.

[Ickey44]

Here's a stat for you guys.....

Joseph = 4 seasons and 11 INT's

Hall = 3 seasons and 14 INT's

hmmm....

Simply means Hall can hold on to a ball better

Also means that Jjoe was hurt for a few of those games and had about 8 dropped INT's his first season. I'm to lazy to go find it, but I would like to see a comparison of Pass defended between the two of them.

Per rotoworld, Leon Hall has 60 over his first three years. JJoe has 68 over his first four years. That works to Hall averaging 20 a year and JJoe averaging 17 a year. Pretty close.