Kirkendall Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Well then, I think that's that. Most support Graham and deflect the game's problems to Chris Henry, offensive line, play calling other factors.I'm confused, this is the first time I've seen a forum moderator offer a summation of a thread. To what end?Oh, you should have seen me back in my day. I would close threads because of punctuation errors, spelling mistakes, corny-movie references, bad fart jokes, the lightening in my room, Melissa Starks (long story) and text-based acronyms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pidge Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 infamous roughing the passer call against Justin Smith allowing TB to take the leadWho will ever forget that?I still lose sleep over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 He has a wonderful percentage (#3 all timeAll the measurables, all the stats, anything quantifiable, Graham shows he is an excellent kicker.So you criticize him by saying he's a choker. Convenient that the quality you say he lacks (ability under pressure) isn't something that can be measured in any way. Completely subjective measurement. I'll say this in his defense - The end of the '06 season had a lot to do with the things that happened before Shayne swung his leg, like the snap and the hold. One last thing, since you are so ready to let Shayne walk, you must know something I don't, that there sits idly by a great kicker we can get in here who will be better than Shayne Graham. Please name him.Bring back Neil Rackers! They are actually back in love with him out here in Arizona.When he kicks like that, I'm not surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet23 Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Opie is a rare bright spot in an Organization full of complete boobs! Saying that he is not good enough to kick for your 1-8-1 Bengals is laughable and makes my stomach hurt... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walrus Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 He has a wonderful percentage (#3 all timeAll the measurables, all the stats, anything quantifiable, Graham shows he is an excellent kicker.So you criticize him by saying he's a choker. Convenient that the quality you say he lacks (ability under pressure) isn't something that can be measured in any way. Completely subjective measurement. I'll say this in his defense - The end of the '06 season had a lot to do with the things that happened before Shayne swung his leg, like the snap and the hold. One last thing, since you are so ready to let Shayne walk, you must know something I don't, that there sits idly by a great kicker we can get in here who will be better than Shayne Graham. Please name him.Bring back Neil Rackers! They are actually back in love with him out here in Arizona.When he kicks like that, I'm not surprised.How did they feel about him two years ago? Better yet, these people should've been here in Cincy in 2000/2001 when he missed 20 of 49 and got blocked twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalPimp Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Meh. A 47 yard FG is no gimme. That said, teams had a terrible day today.He has one of the highest percentages Just wondering what are his percentages from 40+ though because I know alot of em come from 20-30 They sure do....the guy may be accurate, but he has a weak leg (although the 47-yarder had the distance, just went right). The guy is also garbage on kickoffs, and has been his whole career....They don't need to spend money on this guy at the end of the year, that money would be better spent elsewhere.I'm sorry, when you can post facts, we'll take your word to mean something. His "weak leg" had the distance for the 62 yard kick into the wind that he missed WIDE RIGHT last year. His "weak leg" is 8th is % of kickoffs resulting in touchbacks this year. His WEAK leg, has one of the best career % of kicks beyond the 45 of all NFL kickers. Come back when you know what the hell you are talkin about. Jeezus.You want stats Sis ? You got 'emYear Kickoffs Touchbacks2008 33 72007 86 82006 84 132005 91 22004 82 22003 77 4this year, not bad, 2006 also not bad........2003-2005 250 total KOs and a "whopping" 8 TB's ....So he basically has as many TB's this year(7) in 33 KO's, as he had last year(8) in 86 KO's....I'm not bashing the guy, I like him, but facts are facts...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregstephens Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Meh. A 47 yard FG is no gimme. That said, teams had a terrible day today.He has one of the highest percentages Just wondering what are his percentages from 40+ though because I know alot of em come from 20-30 They sure do....the guy may be accurate, but he has a weak leg (although the 47-yarder had the distance, just went right). The guy is also garbage on kickoffs, and has been his whole career....They don't need to spend money on this guy at the end of the year, that money would be better spent elsewhere.I'm sorry, when you can post facts, we'll take your word to mean something. His "weak leg" had the distance for the 62 yard kick into the wind that he missed WIDE RIGHT last year. His "weak leg" is 8th is % of kickoffs resulting in touchbacks this year. His WEAK leg, has one of the best career % of kicks beyond the 45 of all NFL kickers. Come back when you know what the hell you are talkin about. Jeezus.You want stats Sis ? You got 'emYear Kickoffs Touchbacks2008 33 72007 86 82006 84 132005 91 22004 82 22003 77 4this year, not bad, 2006 also not bad........2003-2005 250 total KOs and a "whopping" 8 TB's ....So he basically has as many TB's this year(7) in 33 KO's, as he had last year(8) in 86 KO's....I'm not bashing the guy, I like him, but facts are facts......Yeah, but let's fair here. With the typically piss-poor field position the Bengals' kick-off team allows, I'm not that concerned with the TB's to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 You know, now that nobody has mentioned it.... Isn't it about time for one of those articles about Doug Pelfry traveling the hinterland, sleeping in shelters, and eating from breadlines as he continues his noble search for a paying kicking job? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 You want stats Sis ? You got 'emYear Kickoffs Touchbacks2008 33 72007 86 82006 84 132005 91 22004 82 22003 77 4this year, not bad, 2006 also not bad........2003-2005 250 total KOs and a "whopping" 8 TB's ....So he basically has as many TB's this year(7) in 33 KO's, as he had last year(8) in 86 KO's....I'm not bashing the guy, I like him, but facts are facts......So your gripe is base on what he did 4 years ago and prior? Then I guess we should go sign Olindo Mare, Wade Richey, or Jeff Wilkins. They had sgood seasons in '03 - and that apparently is all that matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walrus Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 You want stats Sis ? You got 'emYear Kickoffs Touchbacks2008 33 72007 86 82006 84 132005 91 22004 82 22003 77 4this year, not bad, 2006 also not bad........2003-2005 250 total KOs and a "whopping" 8 TB's ....So he basically has as many TB's this year(7) in 33 KO's, as he had last year(8) in 86 KO's....I'm not bashing the guy, I like him, but facts are facts......So your gripe is base on what he did 4 years ago and prior? Then I guess we should go sign Olindo Mare, Wade Richey, or Jeff Wilkins. They had sgood seasons in '03 - and that apparently is all that matters.No, he's changing his gripe to focus on Graham's lack of touchbacks after it became apparent that he wasn't getting anywhere with his "Graham is a choker" claim... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC_Bengals_Fan Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Since everyone wants to speak in hard numbers, I'd be interested to see the numbers for the last 3 years in # of games he has"won" in the closing moments by making the kick and ones where he failed to connect. Maybe I'm full of it, but I can't recall manylately where he came in and closed the deal. Like I said earlier, through little fault of his own he has not been put in that situationvery often, but has failed miserably of late when it came down to make the kick and win.Your problem there is that the sample size will be so small that any statistical analysis will have no validity at all.In any event, this seems simply to be another "blame the kicker" exercise. Kickers always get the blame and none of the credit.Look, 47 yard field goals are hard. Field goals in swirling winds are hard. 47 yard field goals WITH swirling winds are just about impossible. I wouldn't give any kicker better than 50% odds there no matter what. So why call the guy a choker for *barely* missing a kick that is, at best, a coin flip for even the league's best kickers?Seriously, of all the problems on this team, K is the exact last thing that keeps me up at night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwjcgc Posted November 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 Since everyone wants to speak in hard numbers, I'd be interested to see the numbers for the last 3 years in # of games he has"won" in the closing moments by making the kick and ones where he failed to connect. Maybe I'm full of it, but I can't recall manylately where he came in and closed the deal. Like I said earlier, through little fault of his own he has not been put in that situationvery often, but has failed miserably of late when it came down to make the kick and win.Your problem there is that the sample size will be so small that any statistical analysis will have no validity at all.In any event, this seems simply to be another "blame the kicker" exercise. Kickers always get the blame and none of the credit.Look, 47 yard field goals are hard. Field goals in swirling winds are hard. 47 yard field goals WITH swirling winds are just about impossible. I wouldn't give any kicker better than 50% odds there no matter what. So why call the guy a choker for *barely* missing a kick that is, at best, a coin flip for even the league's best kickers?Seriously, of all the problems on this team, K is the exact last thing that keeps me up at night.I thought this thread was going to close after the moderator issued summation. Read through my posts, I have granted that statistically he is a great kicker. Based on everyone's feelings here he is also a gentleman and a scholarand a role model for today's youth. However, that has done little to reassure me of his ability to be able to hit a difficult kick to win a game. Is hethe kicker you would want walking onto a snowy, windy field to hit a long kick with a championship or playoff berth on the line?The over-riding thought of my input to this thread is that I don't think he is worth truly elite money if it isrequired to resign him as a free agent after this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalPimp Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 You want stats Sis ? You got 'emYear Kickoffs Touchbacks2008 33 72007 86 82006 84 132005 91 22004 82 22003 77 4this year, not bad, 2006 also not bad........2003-2005 250 total KOs and a "whopping" 8 TB's ....So he basically has as many TB's this year(7) in 33 KO's, as he had last year(8) in 86 KO's....I'm not bashing the guy, I like him, but facts are facts......So your gripe is base on what he did 4 years ago and prior? Then I guess we should go sign Olindo Mare, Wade Richey, or Jeff Wilkins. They had sgood seasons in '03 - and that apparently is all that matters.No, he's changing his gripe to focus on Graham's lack of touchbacks after it became apparent that he wasn't getting anywhere with his "Graham is a choker" claim... Actually, I never called him a "choker". My original comment, which I still stand by, was his lack of leg strength, and the fact that they shouldnt overpay for him at the end of the season. If he signs for a reasonable price, fine, but dont pay him like he's the best in football, because he's not. He's just a good kicker.That said, I will credit him for being a stand up guy. Says and does all the right things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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