Sports Weekly

[redsfan2]

"The unassuming quarterback who keeps his Heisman Trophy in a box effortlessly launches a rocket down the right sideline. Carson Palmers deep pass soars ever higher like a hawk riding a summer thermal.

Suddenly, Palmers pass drops down an invisible chimney into the outstretched hands of Pro Bowl receiver Chad Johnson, who has the cornerback beat by three steps.

Palmers perfect strike traveled an easy 55 yards during the first day of May passing camp.

That's why Bengals coach Marvin Lewis anointed Palmer over 2003 Comeback Player of the Year Jon Kitna two months ago. Palmer makes throws Kitna can only dream of."

That is the opening of an article in Sport Weekly about Palmer titled " Going Deep" by Jim Corbett. It goes on to talk about Palmer getting endorsements from other players .... including Kitna who also gets his props; " Kitna isn't a backstabber. Rather he's that rare, selfless veteran who has Palmers back."

It's an all round good article about Palmer and the Bengals complete with the now obligatory CJ prediction. " We're going to the playoffs. Oh yeah. Easy." Thought it would be worth mentioning due to the fact that it's not often we get a 2 page center spread about our qb and have it be positive. Thought it was also interesting in light of the high profile signings ( qb's ) around the league that they would do an article on Palmer and not them.

Not planning any post season parties yet, but things are definitely looking up.

[ArmyBengal]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nf...25-palmer_x.htm

Another great read about Palmer from USAToday. Didn't want another thread for this article alone.

WHODEY !!!

[BengalszoneBilly]

Great post guys! I couldn't copy and paste it fast enough on the RavensTalk website!

Who said the Army and the Marines couldn't work together! Ooh-Rah! :player:

[redsfan2]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nf...25-palmer_x.htm

Another great read about Palmer from USAToday. Didn't want another thread for this article alone.

WHODEY !!!

Glad you posted it.

Sports Weekly is a USA Today publication, and it's the same article. Actually, this one's better cause you don't have to spend a buck and a half to get it.

God ....... I'm getting to be such a miser

[JPW]

Great article.

Did any one else notice part.

"We had Carson, Boller and Leftwich all rated right there," Billick says. "We were prepared to take any of the three with the 10th pick.

"They each have all the tools. Each had one little flaw. Kyle's was the accuracy. Leftwich was the mobility. With Carson, it was the leadership. He's not quite as dynamic a personality as the other two."

From all that I have read, Palmer has been doing just fine in the Leadership department this spring.

So it that was his "one little flaw", it looks like we are in pretty good shape.

Play Offs in 04....

[BADITUDE]

"We had Carson, Boller and Leftwich all rated right there," Billick says. "We were prepared to take any of the three with the 10th pick.

"They each have all the tools. Each had one little flaw. Kyle's was the accuracy. Leftwich was the mobility. With Carson, it was the leadership. He's not quite as dynamic a personality as the other two."

From all that I have read, Palmer has been doing just fine in the Leadership department this spring.

So it that was his "one little flaw", it looks like we are in pretty good shap.

I agree, the players and coaches all seem to believe that Palmer has thus far displayed enough leadership on the field. It will only get better as he learns to fit into the offense and gains confidence and experience in games.

[Kirkendall]

Keep in mind guys, everything Palmer does during these Spring practices are just that, practices. They aren't in game speed, it's just practice.

Man, I sound like a dick... my bad.

[Bobcat Bengal]

Tell them to get on the bandwagon now, and we won't be mad...

[Bobcat Bengal]

And as far as Carson

its called laid back, coach.

he's from southern cali, damn.

that same even keel is whats gonna make him what he is, a bonafide supastar

he doesnt get rattled, even in his first preseason game. Two back to back INT's for touchdowns, and he still throws a TD? Cmon man....

[JPW]

Another word about Palmer this one from NJ.com.

"-- -- -- Word out of Cincinnati is that second-year quarterback Carson Palmer looked very impressive in the team's recent minicamp and passing camp.

Palmer, the No. 1 pick in the 2003 draft, did not play at all last season but has been named the starter this year by head coach Marvin Lewis.

Lewis and the Bengals are in a pretty good spot. If Palmer does struggle, they could always turn back to last year's starter Jon Kitna, who played well a year ago."

Play Offs in 04....

[chrishcovga]

The only real knocks on Palmer coming out of College were his fantastic rise to fame over an 8 game span his senior year. - but that's negated by the fact that he was a 4 year starter, and was considered to be a lock for a 3rd round pick if he came out his junior year.

* The other knocks were his inconsistency, scouts thought it took him too long to learn his systems, but that's negated by 2 things, one: he had 4 different coordinators during his 5 seasons at U.S.C. two: His second year in Norm Chow's offense turned him into a Heisman Trophy winner, let alone the fact he's had a full year to learn the offense.

* I know it's been debated here for a while about handing over the qb job to Palmer without him earning it on the field, but I have to think that when Palmer hits his stride we have a QB that can put up Favre like numbers for years to come. No Bengal qb has ever thrown for more than 29 touchdowns in a single season, and I think with Palmer you got a guy like Favre that will consistently throw in the low to mid 30's in toucdown passes.

-- I said it before, and I'll say it again, The game doesn't look to big or to fast for him. Palmer's like a M-16, and Kitna's more like a .38 special.

[Barbarian]

Keep in mind guys, everything Palmer does during these Spring practices are just that, practices. They aren't in game speed, it's just practice.

Man, I sound like a dick... my bad.

It does sound dick-ish--but you're right. It's just practice and that is all. Gametime situations are totally different. If you guys remember correctly, Palmer looked average in the Preseason Games last year--but those games are going against scrubs.

WHAT HE DOES IN A REAL GAME IS YET TO BE SEEN.

You guys are getting a raled up for nothing.

[redsfan2]

Keep in mind guys, everything Palmer does during these Spring practices are just that, practices.  They aren't in game speed, it's just practice.

Man, I sound like a dick... my bad.     

It does sound dick-ish--but you're right. It's just practice and that is all. Gametime situations are totally different. If you guys remember correctly, Palmer looked average in the Preseason Games last year--but those games are going against scrubs.

WHAT HE DOES IN A REAL GAME IS YET TO BE SEEN.

You guys are getting a raled up for nothing.

You and Kirk make a valid point. This is practice. The other point that you're overlooking tho ( and I think it's just as important ) is that Palmer is doing things ...... in practice that Kitna just can't do in real games, pre season games, or in practice. Even Kitna has said so. I've said it before, I like Kitna .. even tho I get tired of the rhetoric sometimes ....... bottom line tho is that as much as we'd all like him to, Kitna does not have the talent or the arm of Palmer.

Is there going to be a learning curve ???? Yeah .... most likely. Now how many of you honestly ....... key word honestly think that he'll go 0 and 4 to start the season ????? I don't, but even if he does it won't be any worse than what Kitna did last year. You know what ???? Don't listen to the reporters, his coaches, team mates, or even the guy he's replacing. Check with the competition, and even Jam 31 is saying he'd just as soon we'd start Kitna for the next 3 years. Now why would he wish that ?????

One of the fans was touting their offense ( Kita maybe ?? or Jam 31 ??? whatever ). Well look at our offensive line, running back, receivers ..... admittedly we need on of the TE's to step up, but even so you give Palmer a couple of games and that is going to be an offense to reckon with. The days of us losing 10 to 7 are gone! :player: :player: :player:

[halp]

YO REDS FAN........i do believe KITNA has had a hell of alot to do with the maturity of the receivers that palmer will be throwing to. yes kitna can make the throws. he didn't adjust his throws to the inept routes the receivers ran. he threw the ball where they were suppose to and needed to be as a leader. go ahead and defy this as many of you will try to do. KIT has only made this receiving corps better and, YES, i can't wait for palmer to reap the rewards. THANKS JOHN AND KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! as SPOCK said on STAR TREK; "the needs of the many out way the needs of the few, or one"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Barbarian]

YO REDS FAN........i do believe KITNA has had a hell of alot to do with the maturity of the receivers that palmer will be throwing to.  yes kitna can make the throws.  he didn't adjust his throws to the inept routes the receivers ran.  he threw the ball where they were suppose to and needed to be as a leader.  go ahead and defy this as many of you will try to do.  KIT has only made this receiving corps better and, YES, i can't wait for palmer to reap the rewards.  THANKS JOHN AND KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  as SPOCK said on STAR TREK; "the needs of the many out way the needs of the few, or one"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Halp--I don't know what the Star Trek stuff was about--However, you are absolutely right about the Kitna stuff.

Is there anyone that doesn't think so???

Well, think about this for a second--MAYBE KITNA'S PLAYING WAS THE REASON FOR THE "TURNAROUND"???

Think back to the end of the 2002 Season. The Bungles were struggling--until Kitna took the helm. Automatically, the offensive yardage went up--the points scored per game went up, and the passing numbers skyrocketed?!?!?!?

That's why I was Pro-Kitna starting for 2004 season.

Halp--I was kidding about the Star Trek thing. You do your thing, bro.

[jjakq27]

Well, think about this for a second--MAYBE KITNA'S PLAYING WAS THE REASON FOR THE "TURNAROUND"??? 

Think back to the end of the 2002 Season.  The Bungles were struggling--until Kitna took the helm.  Automatically, the offensive yardage went up--the points scored per game went up, and the passing numbers skyrocketed?!?!?!?

That's why I was Pro-Kitna starting for 2004 season.

Kitna started after game four. His record as the starter was 2-10. Yeah the defense sucked and Dillon couldn't score from the one, and LeBeau was a weak head coach and he had inexperienced WR's, etc, etc . . . but Kitna has limitations on throwing the ball beyond 40 yards and other teams know it.

The Bengals drafted Palmer no. 1 for a reason. I like Kitna as much as the next guy but how many of us were calling for his head after the Raiders game or the Bills game before the bye. I know I was.

If Palmer doesn't work then they still have Kitna. If Palmer is winning games then nobody is going to remember that we had this conversation.

Besides when you are comparing Kitna's numbers to Akili's and Gus Forgots numbers then I would hope that they would be higher.

[denverbengal]

YO REDS FAN........i do believe KITNA has had a hell of alot to do with the maturity of the receivers that palmer will be throwing to.  yes kitna can make the throws.  he didn't adjust his throws to the inept routes the receivers ran.  he threw the ball where they were suppose to and needed to be as a leader.  go ahead and defy this as many of you will try to do.  KIT has only made this receiving corps better and, YES, i can't wait for palmer to reap the rewards.  THANKS JOHN AND KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  as SPOCK said on STAR TREK; "the needs of the many out way the needs of the few, or one"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Halp--I don't know what the Star Trek stuff was about--However, you are absolutely right about the Kitna stuff.

Is there anyone that doesn't think so???

Well, think about this for a second--MAYBE KITNA'S PLAYING WAS THE REASON FOR THE "TURNAROUND"???

Think back to the end of the 2002 Season. The Bungles were struggling--until Kitna took the helm. Automatically, the offensive yardage went up--the points scored per game went up, and the passing numbers skyrocketed?!?!?!?

That's why I was Pro-Kitna starting for 2004 season.

Halp--I was kidding about the Star Trek thing. You do your thing, bro.

I have to agree that Kitna has contributed to the maturation and development of the Bengals receiving corps. His leadership, and ability to get the most out of his team-mates is undeniable. But the ability to motivate and teach does not a great play-making quarterback make. And to say that he was the reason for the "turnaround" is misguided at best. There's ONE reason for the turnaround, and one reason alone and that's Marvin Lewis...enough said.

Let's take a look at the 2002 season where Kit supposedly turned it around...

Kit got his first start that year in game 5 in which he lost to the Colts. He subsequently lost the next 2. In his first 3 starts he threw a total of 3 touchdowns to 6 interceptions. He got his first win of the season in his 4th start against the Houston Texans in which he threw 4 td's to 0 int's. He then lost his next 6 starts before beating the Saints in the 15th game of the season, and then went on to lose game 16 to the Bills.

In 12 starts that year, Kit was 2-10. He threw 16 td's to 15 int's. Yes, there are other deciding factors that determine the outcome of a game. In his defense, Kit has never had a truly great D supporting him. And you could argue that his receivers and O-line are responsible for some of those int's. But it's the qb's responsibility to make smart decisions and good throws. I would hardly call that a turnaround. Maybe a mediocre Kitna looked great because he was playing on a 2-14 team.

But what about last year?

In Kit's 8 wins he threw 20 td-s to 1 int. That's truly phenomenal. If he had kept that consistency in EVERY game, we'd still be basking in the glory of our first superbowl win today, and Barb, you wouldn't be referring to the team as the Bungles. But Kitna is way too inconsistent to lead this team to any kind of post-season play. And that's the main reason ML is going with Carson this year. In his 8 losses, Kit threw 6 td's to 14 int's. You can try and blame the "young" receiving corps for those picks, but I don't see how they got it right for 8 games, but forgot how to run routes the other 8.

The bottom line is, in 2004 Kitna will be playing the role that he is best fit to play on this team, and that is mentor, leader, role-model, and backup to the qb that has the real play-making potential. Yes, Kit's contribution to the success of this team was essential, and I'm thankful for it. But, in the end, his best season ever still wasn't enough to lead the team past .500. And it probably never will be.

[redsfan2]

Man .... I go away for a couple of days, and you guys jump all over this.

The point that Kitna was a major player in the development of the receivers is inarguable. CJ has pretty much said the same thing. Whether or not last year was a turning point for Warrick remains to be seen, but if it was then I'd credit Kitna for helping him as well. He didn't have as much time with Washington, so we'll just have to wait and see on him. On the same note, I think it's true that Palmer will be the beneficiary of a great deal of not only Kitnas work but Lewis' as well .... along with the receivers coach and the offensive line coach.

As to the " turnaround" ...... Yeah ... that's a tough one to call. LeBeau couldn't coach his way out of an automatic door, so the qb carousel was a fiasco from day one. A lot of things went into Kitna doing well in the last couple of games of that season .... not the least of which were that the season was all but over, and no one was taking us seriously. It was pretty easy to sneak up on people at that point ..... and as DenverBengal points out all that still only led to 2 wins.

As to last year, if you go back and read the posts on this board you'll see that Kitna was always one bad throw away from being thrown over for Palmer right then and there. In all fairness, that wasn't everyones opinion, but there were quite a few. Since the team went 8 and 8, do you think Kitna should take as much blame for the losses as credit for the wins ???

Kirk and I ( as well as others ) have had this " discussion " before, and the one thing that never changes is the opinion of the " other guy ".

I, like you obviously and a lot of others, like Kitna. He's a hell of guy. Thing is tho that Palmer is going to start sooner or later and this is the easiest & least painful way of doing it for all involved. Think of the controversy of waiting till Kitna did poorly to put Palmer in. Lewis thought this was the best way and the best time to do it, and while I don't always agree with him ..... I have to admit it usually turns out he's right.

Last thing ........ One of the reporters asked Palmer about overthrowing Chad Johnson on a deep route ??? Palmers reply was that he didn't think it was possible to overthrow Johnson. When was the last time you heard anyone ask Kitna if he was concerned about overthrowing anyone ?????

[jjakq27]

As to last year, if you go back and read the posts on this board you'll see that Kitna was always one bad throw away from being thrown over for Palmer right then and there. In all fairness, that wasn't everyones opinion, but there were quite a few. Since the team went 8 and 8, do you think Kitna should take as much blame for the losses as credit for the wins ???

Not to beat a dead horse anymore but.....Kitna (and the Bengals) were 1-4 before the bye and 7-4 after the bye when they finally settled on Rudi to do the bulk of the running. However in the 8 wins the biggest margin of victory was only 8 points. Some of that can be blamed on the defense but I still feel like the Bengals were limited to the types of passes they could throw because of him.