SAM ADAMS CUT

[agreen_112]

I feel bad for the guy, they didn't even give him a chance... Something bad must've happened or he got even fatter during the off season.

I haven't heard anyone mention the Jungle Kats and his part ownership of the team. Do you think he'll stick around or sell his part?

[Kazkal]

I feel bad for the guy,always liked sam...wonder if this mean junglecats goes byebye.

[agreen_112]

I feel bad for the guy,always liked sam...wonder if this mean junglecats goes byebye.

damn where we thinking the same thing or what???

[Kazkal]

Ya but UFC still > Boxing

[agreen_112]

Ya but UFC still > Boxing

Whatever dude! Peace out Sam.. Good luck.

[Kazkal]

Well hopfully this means BiG toe has a chance of staying on the main squad rather then practice.

[HoosierCat]

I never thought he would be a big impact guy but why him over Thornton? I know he's a NT and Thornton is a UT but still Thornton is the worst of the bunch and he's eating up massive cap.

Oh please. "Worst of the bunch"? Thornton is a perfectly good one-gap DT who can be counted on for 40 or so tackles, a few sacks and a FF or two a year. He might be somewhat overpaid but at least he produces something. I've never understood the sh*t rain fans seem to level on him. But I suppose if you're making more than league minimum and aren't a Pro Bowler that's what you get in Cincy...sheesh.

[Dadraftnick]

I knew that this was coming, when you look at what he did last year,or didn't do.

You can't give a guy over 3 million a year to get 14 tackles.

I also saw him in alot of other teams highlights where he was blocked and took out a couple of teamates with him on the play because of his size.

The Bengals had to know that they were going to make this move before the draft, which makes drafting a nickel back with your first pick instead of a run stuffer like Alan Branch even more suspect.

The Bengals just picked a decent nickel back in Blue Adams,not to mention guys like Greg Brooks and Ratcliff.

The bigger question that I have is, if they knew that going to make this move, is why not use the money that they were going save by cutting Adams to keep the players that they lost in free agency?

Shuan Smith and Stienbeck went to Cleveland and now we are now going to have to face them twice a year ,Kaseviharn had game winning or changing interceptions in quite a few games .

The money that they saved by cutting Adams could have saved loosing a couple of those players.

Why not do (cut Adams)it when it could have helpled.

There is no players left to spend the money on ,awww shucks Mike Brown will have to pocket the money.

[HoosierCat]

The Bengals had to know that they were going to make this move before the draft, which makes drafting a nickel back with your first pick instead of a run stuffer like Alan Branch even more suspect.

I wouldn't have squaked about Branch, but I think Hall will end up being more than just a nickle back.

The bigger question that I have is, if they knew that going to make this move, is why not use the money that they were going save by cutting Adams to keep the players that they lost in free agency?

Because the savings is only about $700k. I doubt that would have been enough to hang onto to anyone. Certainly not Steinback or K2.

[Kazkal]

he Bengals just picked a decent nickel back in Blue Adams,not to mention guys like Greg Brooks and Ratcliff.

How do we know blue is a decent nickel back? for tampa he was nothing but a special teamer no?he has had 0 passes defended in 3 years 0 ints in 3 years yet he's a decent nickel back when hes never defended a pass! O_O!

[Walrus]

I'm disappointed because we now have one less reason to hope for better out of our D. Maybe someone will step up and do a better job, but what a letdown after reading all the Hobson Hype building up my hopes for one more big year for Sam! All the best, big guy...

[James_Brooks21]

The Bengals had to know that they were going to make this move before the draft, which makes drafting a nickel back with your first pick instead of a run stuffer like Alan Branch even more suspect.

The Bengals just picked a decent nickel back in Blue Adams,not to mention guys like Greg Brooks and Ratcliff.

The bigger question that I have is, if they knew that going to make this move, is why not use the money that they were going save by cutting Adams to keep the players that they lost in free agency?

Shuan Smith and Stienbeck went to Cleveland and now we are now going to have to face them twice a year ,Kaseviharn had game winning or changing interceptions in quite a few games .

The money that they saved by cutting Adams could have saved loosing a couple of those players.

Why not do (cut Adams)it when it could have helpled.

There is no players left to spend the money on ,awww shucks Mike Brown will have to pocket the money.

Get out of here man, I don't think anybody on the line (defense or offense) is scared of facing Shaun Smith or Steinbach twice a year that's a joke. If Shaun Smith is killing our offensive line then we have a lot bigger problems then facing him twice a year. Why in the hell would they reach for Alan Branch in the first round; Alan Brach fell all the way to the secound round for a reason, now if you would have said trade up in the second round (which we were unable to do without a third round pick) to get Brach I would have been right with you but reach and pick a guy at 18 who didn't get picked into the second round would have been a dumb move on their part. Hall is not just a nickel back my friend, he will eventually be a starter we were hurting worse at cornerback then defensive line, and we might have drafted the best corner in the draft. Why should we had paid Eric Steinbach all that money when we had an adequate person to slide in his position with Whitworth and saved a lot of money. Have you ever heard of June 1 cuts; there will be some good veterns getting cut in June that we can possibly spend that money on, plus we can use that money to sign Justin Smith or Madieu to a long term contract, great move by the Bengals by getting rid of him.

[hrod382]

I understood then and I understand now the reasons for NOT drafting Branch. Hall will be a nickle back for 8-16 games then he's our #2... Branch has plenty of question marks surrounding him.

I'm looking forward to seeing what big Toe can do.

[BlainThePain]

My guess is he came in too out of shape and after pledging to get into better shape in the offseason, Marvin got sick of it and cut him.

[Kazkal]

If Shaun Smith is killing our offensive line then we have a lot bigger problems then facing him twice a year.

Hell we got rid of the person that would have problems with shaun smith.

don't let the door hit ya steinbach where the good lord split ya.

[GregCook]

Sam Adams, 34 years of age, huge big man has lost a step or two. Good enough reason to cut anyone.

BRob is next in cut line as they have a glut at DE and he's 33 years of age.

[HairOnFire]

I never thought he would be a big impact guy but why him over Thornton? I know he's a NT and Thornton is a UT but still Thornton is the worst of the bunch and he's eating up massive cap.

1 - Thornton is better than most give him credit for....especially as an interior pass rusher. Granted, he rarely sacks the QB but he's an outstanding hand fighter, and when it comes to applying pressure he's the most consistent interior lineman the Bengals have.

2 - Thornton may define what it means to be an average DT, but he's capable of being a true starter. At best Adams was a run stuffing role player who in recent seasons proved incapable of playing more than 25% of defensive snaps.

3 - Thornton, despite playing far more snaps doesn't have the same injury risk as Adams. In fact, Thornton has proven to be a very durable if unspectacular player.

4 - For all of his faults, some real...some only imagined, John Thornton keeps himself in shape. Adams hasn't been in shape for more years than I'm willing to count, and I'm betting he wasn't able to this offseason despite his promise to do so. Regardless, it's questionable that Sam Adams could hold up even if he somehow managed to report at 320 lbs. Seriously, that's still pretty freakin huge and Adams seems increasingly vulnerable to dings both big and small.

5 - Thornton recently admitted that he feared being cut for salary cap reasons and as a result had done everything possible to have an outstanding season. Time will tell if that's true, but the best we've ever seen Thornton play was when he was paired with Tony Williams, an active DT in the same mold as the emerging Domata Peko. Add Micheal Myers and da' Big Toe and you have the makings of a unit whose sum could be greater than it's individual parts.

6 - Cap savings? I've read that slashing Fat Sam saved the Bengals 700k...a fairly tidy sum when you consider how little Adams was likely to play. By comparison, cutting Thornton saves the team more money, but dictates a greater replacement for the reasons listed above.

7 - Reputation can be a heavy burden. Simply put, the signing of Adams made headlines that Adams wasn't able to justify, and as a result Adams was one of a handful of players openly called out by Marvin Lewis. If the Bengals had no confidence that Adams could actually improve on last seasons poor performance then there was no reason to delay the decision to cut him. In fact, the exact opposite was true as cutting a disappointing high profile player now sends a signal that name recognition alone won't guarantee anyone a roster spot. Just ask Brian Simmons.

[Walrus]

7 - Reputation can be a heavy burden. Simply put, the signing of Adams made headlines that Adams wasn't able to justify, and as a result Adams was one of a handful of players openly called out by Marvin Lewis. If the Bengals had no confidence that Adams could actually improve on last seasons poor performance then there was no reason to delay the decision to cut him. In fact, the exact opposite was true as cutting a disappointing high profile player now sends a signal that name recognition alone won't guarantee anyone a roster spot. Just ask Brian Simmons.

It also shows that Marvin won't play favorites -- Sam is obviously someone for whom Marvin has a great deal of respect and is a guy Marvin seems to like as a person as much as anyone on the team.

But honestly, I can't make much sense out of the tea leaves just yet. Seems like there are still some things known only to Marvin and Co that will become apparent to the lay-fan as some of the other "question mark" guys get some playing time.

[hrod382]

HairOnFire... You argue a good point. The health issue is a good one, I do agree that Thornton isn't a bad pass rusher but I'd honestly still rather cut bait with him and move on.

I do completely agree that Thornton is the definition of the average DT. It's just all that money he eats up doesn't warrant the risk for me.

Granted, now that I think about it I'm not sure who else would play UT other than Robinson. Not sure between Big Toe/the FA signees which ones are UT guys.

[HoosierCat]

It also shows that Marvin won't play favorites -- Sam is obviously someone for whom Marvin has a great deal of respect and is a guy Marvin seems to like as a person as much as anyone on the team.

Maybe. I dunno. To me it seemed that Marvin was extremely noncommittal regarding Sam last season, and accepted him only reluctantly -- and even then played Coach Hardcase, insisting on weight and conditioning goals before he even got to practice.

Notably, he seemed similarly reluctant about Hartwell this time around. My own completely uninformed guess is that while Marvin does respect these guys, he wants to make it on his own, so to speak. That is, he wants to get away from the "great Baltimore D of 2000" thing, show that he can be a Super Bowl coach w/o Sam and Goose and Ray-Ray and all that. That he has something, that it wasn't just him getting in a lucky situation with a bunch of great players. If so, I can understand that.

[The PatternMaster]

It also shows that Marvin won't play favorites -- Sam is obviously someone for whom Marvin has a great deal of respect and is a guy Marvin seems to like as a person as much as anyone on the team.

Maybe. I dunno. To me it seemed that Marvin was extremely noncommittal regarding Sam last season, and accepted him only reluctantly -- and even then played Coach Hardcase, insisting on weight and conditioning goals before he even got to practice.

Notably, he seemed similarly reluctant about Hartwell this time around. My own completely uninformed guess is that while Marvin does respect these guys, he wants to make it on his own, so to speak. That is, he wants to get away from the "great Baltimore D of 2000" thing, show that he can be a Super Bowl coach w/o Sam and Goose and Ray-Ray and all that. That he has something, that it wasn't just him getting in a lucky situation with a bunch of great players. If so, I can understand that.

maybe Marv doesn't want to give someone a free ride based on past performances, meaning if these guys can't help us win now and in the future then it doesn't matter how friendly they are, this is a business.

Guys like Adams and Hartwell are coming to town for a reason, they are risker players who other teams have given up one for very good reasons. These guys have something to prove to Marvin and to the NFL, we just saw one big name player get cut because he couldn't "cut it", now is not the time to play favorites.

[Walrus]

My own completely uninformed guess is that while Marvin does respect these guys, he wants to make it on his own, so to speak. That is, he wants to get away from the "great Baltimore D of 2000" thing, show that he can be a Super Bowl coach w/o Sam and Goose and Ray-Ray and all that. That he has something, that it wasn't just him getting in a lucky situation with a bunch of great players. If so, I can understand that.

Ha! Well, you couldn't get much farther from Baltimore 2k than our D. So, kudos for creating something new and original. And crappy.

[HoosierCat]

Ha! Well, you couldn't get much farther from Baltimore 2k than our D. So, kudos for creating something new and original. And crappy.

All too true. But in Marvin's defense he's had more than his share of bad breaks. You have to wonder what the D would be like if, say, Rogers Beckett hadn't been knocked out of football by concussions, Pollack hadn't broken his neck and Odell wasn't an idiot. Or Webster hadn't ripped up his knee. Or Weathersby hadn't gone into a guardrail. Or even if Fat Sam hadn't gotten hurt last year. And on and on. If there's any reason to be down on the Bengals D this year, it's that Lady Luck seems to hate it.

maybe Marv doesn't want to give someone a free ride based on past performances, meaning if these guys can't help us win now and in the future then it doesn't matter how friendly they are, this is a business.

Oh, I don't think Marvin would play favorites...all I'm saying is that I think any time someone suggests they sign someone "from that great 2000 D," Marvins hackles go up. And if that player wants to stick they had better do something extraordinary, because Marvin wants to build a future, not rest on past laurels.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

As for JT, he gets a bad rap because he's never shown that he's worth the contract he's signed. Additionally, he's not too great against the run. That said, the market has finally caught up to his contract, so while it might have been worth cutting him at one point, a starting vet DT who has some miles in the tank is probably worth the $3M he's making now.

Like it or not, with Sam cut he's staying.

As for BRob, the thing keeping him on the team is his ability to play DE, so the wild card affecting whether he stays or goes will probably be Rucker, whether he amounts to anything or not. If Rucker does anything in the preseason I could see Robinson getting cut.

[Kazkal]

As for JT, he gets a bad rap because he's never shown that he's worth the contract he's signed. Additionally,

3-4 million is about what a avg DT goes for.

As for BRob, the thing keeping him on the team is his ability to play DE, so the wild card affecting whether he stays or goes will probably be Rucker, whether he amounts to anything or not. If Rucker does anything in the preseason I could see Robinson getting cut.

Rucker doesn't seem to well suited play inside....I think Brobs spot will come down to if they see enough in fanene but youth should win out since jumpy should start.