ChadJohnson-85 Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 I'd like to see Justin get re-signed before 2007. If he dosent get resigned then ML better draft a DE in the first round next year and a TE in the second! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Levi played preatty damn good for only having 1 leg =P better then that tackle the browns made 35million for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Some Justin love on coach speak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 It's funny, first I had to listen that we couldn't afford to keep Steinback because we need to put more $$$ on D, now I have to listen to how we can't afford market prices for a (hypotehtical) double-digit sack artist. Will you people make up your mind?And while we're not spending money on Eric and while we're not spending money on Justin...well, what are we going to do with it. Extending role players like Landon and Caleb won't cost that much. I say we buy Mikey a Porche or 10.I am one of the main guys in favor of letting Steiny go... so I will let you know that my mind is made up. This is exactly the kind of situation I was talking about.It's not really about wheteher we can afford Steiny or not. We can... but my argument is that it's not a wise purchase. You don't build dynasties by paying high prices for guys that you no longer NEED, because of high draft picks that were used to replace them.So to clear the air... I'm being incredibly consistent. I WANT SMITH BACK!!! I also want Madieu to be a lifetime Bengal, and I want Deltha extended. I don't want Steiny back. I want Whitworth to be our LG next year. Break the bank on Smith! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TippCityRick Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Maybe not "break the bank" but get him extended if at all possible. Smith's sack numbers have not lived up to a no 4 pick, but he's always been stout against the run. Now with some help up front and playing his natural position, I look for him to have a great year pressuring the qb. Will he have 3 sacks each Sunday . . . nah. But he'll put more pressure on the qb than in the past and his hustle has never been denied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Maybe not "break the bank" but get him extended if at all possible. Smith's sack numbers have not lived up to a no 4 pick, but he's always been stout against the run. Now with some help up front and playing his natural position, I look for him to have a great year pressuring the qb. Will he have 3 sacks each Sunday . . . nah. But he'll put more pressure on the qb than in the past and his hustle has never been denied.I don't care about sack numbers. He's a very reliable, very consistent DE. His pass rushing abilities have always been solid. Maybe not elite... but he's also been going against double-teams since his 2nd year in the league. Now that it's changing, he'll get some respect around here.Sure, I was being a bit hyperbolic with the "break the bank" line... but I want to pay him whatever the market will bear. The Shula's of the world will cry bloody murder... but he plays 16 games a year (which is more than you can say for the "elite" John Abraham), and he's very solid. If we let him get away to another team that's willing to pay him what he's worth, I'll be the one crying bloody murder, because you don't let guys like him get away when you don't have high quality guys on the roster to replace him.We have the cap room, we aren't spending any money on this defense as it stands. We don't need to lose one of the few solid veterans we have on this D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 I think the Bengals have shown, without a question at this point, that if they want to keep a guy, they will do what it takes to lock them up. So, I would expect, if they like Justin as much as I think they do (and I hope they do), they will find a way to lock him up as well.I do know, again, that he would be much harder to replace than certain folks seem to think... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesperateDerelict Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 I think the Bengals have shown, without a question at this point, that if they want to keep a guy, they will do what it takes to lock them up. So, I would expect, if they like Justin as much as I think they do (and I hope they do), they will find a way to lock him up as well.I do know, again, that he would be much harder to replace than certain folks seem to think...If Marvin, Chuck, & the Bengals are indeed moving towards a 3-4 base defense, there is NO reason to sign Justin. He is a 4-3 DE only, and is one of the players Marvin continually referred to when explaining that he did not have the personnel to run a base 3 - 4. With Justin gone, Bryan Robinson moves over to DE, and we get our strong, young, and speedy LB's out on the field.Still need a NT though - I don't think Big Sam can stand up to the pounding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tasher Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 I think the Bengals have shown, without a question at this point, that if they want to keep a guy, they will do what it takes to lock them up. So, I would expect, if they like Justin as much as I think they do (and I hope they do), they will find a way to lock him up as well.I do know, again, that he would be much harder to replace than certain folks seem to think...If Marvin, Chuck, & the Bengals are indeed moving towards a 3-4 base defense, there is NO reason to sign Justin. He is a 4-3 DE only, and is one of the players Marvin continually referred to when explaining that he did not have the personnel to run a base 3 - 4. With Justin gone, Bryan Robinson moves over to DE, and we get our strong, young, and speedy LB's out on the field.Still need a NT though - I don't think Big Sam can stand up to the pounding.Peko. Rookie THIS year. NOT a rookie next year! Who Dey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Maybe not "break the bank" but get him extended if at all possible. Smith's sack numbers have not lived up to a no 4 pick, but he's always been stout against the run. Now with some help up front and playing his natural position, I look for him to have a great year pressuring the qb. Will he have 3 sacks each Sunday . . . nah. But he'll put more pressure on the qb than in the past and his hustle has never been denied.sack numbers sack numbers sack numbers,theres more to a freaking DE then sack numbers.I think the Bengals have shown, without a question at this point, that if they want to keep a guy, they will do what it takes to lock them up. So, I would expect, if they like Justin as much as I think they do (and I hope they do), they will find a way to lock him up as well.I do know, again, that he would be much harder to replace than certain folks seem to think...If Marvin, Chuck, & the Bengals are indeed moving towards a 3-4 base defense, there is NO reason to sign Justin. He is a 4-3 DE only, and is one of the players Marvin continually referred to when explaining that he did not have the personnel to run a base 3 - 4. With Justin gone, Bryan Robinson moves over to DE, and we get our strong, young, and speedy LB's out on the field.Still need a NT though - I don't think Big Sam can stand up to the pounding.Most people who wanna keep justin wanna stick 4-3 why start fresh when 4-3 is what your players know,4-3 is what your players are ment for...Also if you say sam can't be 3-4 NT and we switch too it then we're wasting money on him...myself I think peko makes better 4-3 DT then he would NT where all he suppossed do is eat blocks sense his ass can penetrate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 It's funny, first I had to listen that we couldn't afford to keep Steinback because we need to put more $$$ on D, now I have to listen to how we can't afford market prices for a (hypotehtical) double-digit sack artist. Will you people make up your mind? Different people...different opinions. I'm not a dedicated cap cruncher so I could be mistaken about the following, but the only thing that seems clear at this point is the Bengals should/might have the ability to get one more extension done before the end of the season, and only then if the player in question is so open to the idea of remaining a Bengal that his camp shows flexibility in how the deal is structured. And at this point it definately seems to be a choice of Justin or Steinbach. And frankly, the Willie Anderson signing implies that the Bengals have given up on the idea of extending Steinbach. That leaves a mid-season push for Smith, something they might get done due to his willingness to remain a Bengal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Atm were about 7million under http://cap.go-bengals.com/So really don't see it being that hard to resign justin sense his cap number woulden't be much more then it is now and everyone we have now probbley won't have much of a higher cap number then they do now besides landon....People need resign next seasonKyle larsonJustin smith (hells ya)Caleb MillerLandon JohnsonGreg brooks(we also looks mitchell and bauman but i'm in different to them resigning)Tory James (you served us well but inless you wanna sign for low money and be nicke corner : ( Madieu needs a new contract next year though his current expires 2007stacey andrews and Scott Kooistra both expire in 2006 (*** damn before season started 7 Olinemens contracts were expiringreggie kelly (probbley resigned for same amount or cheaper)Tony stewart (let him walk!Kdub,kenny watson and our back up QB's(damn quite abit of contracts going up next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Madieu needs a new contract next year though his current expires 2007You don't even want to give him time to think about what he might get in free agency. Pay this man now. Make him want to be a lifetime Bengal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agreen_112 Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Justin Smith has been a chronic underachiever (and rumored to have issues with alcohol...sued over a New Year's eve drunken fight....DUI). Remember that Reinard Wilson came alive during his contract year?? That turned out well for us right??Smith's production over the last four years does not justify a fat contract. There are other guys who can give you the same production for less money.I'm not saying that Smith wouldn't be worth it if he fully dedicated himself, but if it takes a contract year for the guy to perform, I say find another option.I agree with what your saying, if he does have a breakout year on the last year of his contract I don't know if I would give him a huge raise (give him a raise, he's definitely worth keeping but not a huge one). Justin's a good end but if he demands too much then we're going to have to just let him go and pick up a #1 pick somewhere next year.Madieu needs a new contract next year though his current expires 2007You don't even want to give him time to think about what he might get in free agency. Pay this man now. Make him want to be a lifetime Bengal.yep that's the best thing to do probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 It's funny, first I had to listen that we couldn't afford to keep Steinback because we need to put more $$$ on D, now I have to listen to how we can't afford market prices for a (hypotehtical) double-digit sack artist. Will you people make up your mind? Different people...different opinions. I'm not a dedicated cap cruncher so I could be mistaken about the following, but the only thing that seems clear at this point is the Bengals should/might have the ability to get one more extension done before the end of the season, and only then if the player in question is so open to the idea of remaining a Bengal that his camp shows flexibility in how the deal is structured. And at this point it definately seems to be a choice of Justin or Steinbach. And frankly, the Willie Anderson signing implies that the Bengals have given up on the idea of extending Steinbach. That leaves a mid-season push for Smith, something they might get done due to his willingness to remain a Bengal.According to the last I saw from geoff, the Bengals had a few million left -- set aside in the usual injury fund. If that's still there toward the end of December (knock on wood) I expect they'll try to use it, a la Palmer last year. Whether it's enough to get a major deal done done, I dunno, but certainly if they wanted to extend one or two important mid-tier types or special teamers, they could do that.They could keep both Justiin and Eric, but I agree, it doesn't look like that's the plan. I wouldn't object to keeping Smith, even tho as you said it will take a sizeable package. My rant is directed at the idea that this -- paying the going rate for a player of his abilities at his position -- constitutes overpaying, with its subtext that we could let him go and not miss a beat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spain Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Franchise him , some team will bite and get the draft picks. Sign Steiny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 we could let him go and not miss a beat.Don't think that will happen though inless we switch to 3-4Franchise him , some team will bite and get the draft picks. Sign Steiny.Sign justin franchise steinbach and trade him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekshank Posted September 13, 2006 Report Share Posted September 13, 2006 Franchise him, some team will bite and get the draft picks. Sign Steiny.No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.The flaws in this theory are many. Firstly... no one is going to pay top 5 DE money to Justin Smith. He's quality, and I don't want to see him go... but market value for Justin Smith is not franchise money... so we would be stuck paying top 5 money for Smith, when we could have just extended him at market value and kept him.Secondly, it's silly to think that we have enough DE depth to let him go. Geathers is not an every down DE. He's great on passing downs... but he's a big step back from Smith in every other way. Who knows what we're getting from Rucker and Robinson who is getting old is only signed through '07 anyway. Smith is one of the long-term guys on this line.Thirdly, Even if someone did manage to get draft picks for Smith, that forces us to use our earliest pick(s) on a DE. That DE, will be a rookie, and by definition be a step back... not to mention that it goes against our "best available player" strategy. You don't want to be in a position that you are forced to take a specific position in the draft. That is not how you build dynasties. That is how you make reaches in the draft that end up biting you in the ass.Fourthly, and I've made this as clear as I can... signing Steiny isn't in the plans. We used a 2nd round pick on Whitworth. Marvin said that we'd sign whichever O-Linemen were willing to sign first. Those guys were Levi and Willie. Steiny didn't sign, so the plan is to move on. Whatever your opinion on that move is... it seems pretty undeniable that that's the plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spain Posted September 14, 2006 Report Share Posted September 14, 2006 The leauge looks at stats, J smith is on his way, some sorry ass team will sign him, let him go if he trys to bus our balls. Give the money to Bach! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 14, 2006 Report Share Posted September 14, 2006 Spain.....NO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 14, 2006 Report Share Posted September 14, 2006 People are knocking justin because he got 3 sacks vs a crappy team...a team with a crappy Oline well everyone seems like they rather have dwight freeny.Dwights Sacks last yearJags (1 sack Browns (3 sacks (can we say MVP!)49ers (1 sackTexan (1 sacktexans(1 sackPits (half sack)titans (2 sacks wow awesome vs the titans!!!)Chargers (1 Sack)Cardinals(half sack)11 sacks vs what what good team? vs what quality Oline? ya I know he gets QB preasures to but sense people seem like to go off sack numbers dwight diden't rack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazkal Posted September 14, 2006 Report Share Posted September 14, 2006 2006: D'Brickashaw Ferguson2005: Cedric Benson2004: Philip Rivers2003: Dewayne Robertson2002: Mike Williams (OT)2001: Justin Smith2000: Peter WarrickHe's also the best 4# pick sense 2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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