BZBot Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 After JoiseyCat and Kirkendall published their articles defending BengalsZone.com, comments quickly filled up our mailbags. We'd like to share some with you. Source: http://www.bengalszone.com/article.php?sid=418 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengalboomer7 Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Delusional hypocrits Not only are they nieve enough to think Steelers fans are perfect, they blast Bengals fans for doing the same thing they did when Carson went down.What no one has said, is that just about NO ONE wished ill will towards Ben, but were merely pointing out the "Karma effect" on all Steelers fans that raided this board in January with screen names like "KimoTherapy" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsbengalsbucks Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 What I liked was the guy saying that the Pittsburgh's organization was to classy to allow a multiple offender stay on the team. Has Holmes been released yet?There is a reason lots of different teams fans have chipped in to rag on the Steelers since their Asterisk bowl win, they have one of the dirtiest playing teams in the NFL and everyone, but steeler fans, knows it.I'm glad that Ben is all right, but he was an idiot for taking the risks he did. It is very interesting that in one of the eye-witness accounts that I read after the accident, a women was stated as seeing a scruffy man pass her on the way to the interesection. She says she saw the car turning and knew the speeding motorcycle was not going to make it. She later adds she did not know it was Ben untill later in the day when she heard it on TV.The police cited Ben for no license, but claim he was doing 35 in a 35 zone. Sounds like someone is getting prefferential treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShulaSteakhouse Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Yawn, the dog days of the off-season are truly upon us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjakq27 Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 What I liked was the guy saying that the Pittsburgh's organization was to classy to allow a multiple offender stay on the team. Has Holmes been released yet?The police cited Ben for no license, but claim he was doing 35 in a 35 zone. Sounds like someone is getting prefferential treatment. Remember class also rhymes with ass.Also what happened to the lady's car? Was she cited or does Ben have some responsibility to her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denverbengal Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Other times it turns FIFA world soccer and that's the most insulting part. When fans attack other fans, verbally, physically and maliciously, then you ruin the sport and turn it into the culture 99% of us hate; WORLD SOCCER!With the exeption of the above quotes, I agree with every point. Excellent article. Just curious as to why the soccer bashing? Isn't generalizing the world soccer culture (of which I'm proud to be a part), the same thing that some Steeler fans (and beat writers) have been doing...categorizing fans based on the actions/opinions of some? I would never attack another fan verbally, physically or maliciously. I doubt many of the other 1% of us (sarcasm intended) would either.I'm not trying to start *hit, or turn this thread into a soccer vs football debate. As a lover of both sports, I was just really bothered by those comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkendall Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Maybe we are, maybe we're not. That's in the eye of beholder and what you really think of World Soccer. It is after all an opinion; not a survey. But my opinion, unlike Ray's, is based on historical facts; not twisting members comments on a message board.ESPN doesn't run pieces on wide ranged RACISM pieces with the NFL in the lead up to the Super Bowl.http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/spor..._cuprace09.htmlAn NFL head coach isn't shot dead by a referree for questioning their calls ON THE FIELD.http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/socc...ccer/index.htmlYou don't see riots at NFL games.http://www.crowddynamics.com/Disasters/Sta...20Disasters.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denverbengal Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Maybe we are, maybe we're not. That's in the eye of beholder and what you really think of World Soccer. It is after all an opinion; not a survey. But my opinion, unlike Ray's, is based on historical facts; not twisting members comments on a message board.ESPN doesn't run pieces on wide ranged RACISM pieces with the NFL in the lead up to the Super Bowl.http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/spor..._cuprace09.htmlAn NFL head coach isn't shot dead by a referree for questioning their calls ON THE FIELD.http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/socc...ccer/index.htmlYou don't see riots at NFL games.http://www.crowddynamics.com/Disasters/Sta...20Disasters.htmAgain, I'm not trying to start a debate (guess it's too late for that). I just took exception to the implication that World (cup?) Soccer fans are inferior sports fans. There are examples of violence in every sport (see Pistons-Pacers for example). For every soccer-related act of violence that the headline hungry media provides, there are thousands of examples of good sportsmanship between opposing fans that never get published because they don't sell papers or ad space. Do you think the public would rather read about how the Brazilian and Austalian fans treated each other with respect during yesterday's game, and partied together afterward, or about the referee in bum-f*ck South Africa who shot a coach of a small-town local team? The World Cup soccer culture you allude to is a reflection of world society, not the fans of any particular sport. No, ESPN doesn't run pieces on racism before the superbowl because racism isn't as rampant here as it is in Germany and other parts of Europe. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist in the NFL.No, no NFL head coach has ever been shot by a ref, but neither has any major league professional soccer coach (ok, that I know of). The particular article you provided was about a local team in a country whose murder rate (44.7 murders per 100,000 people) is 8 times that of the U.S. Let's also not forget that violence sometimes breaks out in little league sports all over America...baseball, hockey, football, and yes soccer...parents fighting parents. No, you don't see riots at NFL games, but you certainly see them in American cities after the home team has won its respective championship. And random acts of violence are commonplace at NFL games. Wasn't there a thread last year about a Bengal fan who was hospitalized in Jacksonville after he was beaten in a parking lot under the stadium after the Jags game?I'm not trying to bash you Josh. I thought it was an excellent article. As a soccer and football fan, I just don't think any one particular sports' fans are better than those of another sport, whehther there's history to back it up or not...that's all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Stiller Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 More of the same from you. Defense mode in full swing, not even paying attention to the main theme of the article. I agree with Kirkendall 100%. I have a problem with the few fans who said stupid things bout Ben's accident. I have a problem with the few Steelers fans that celebrated Palmer's injury as well. Anyone who makes such statements is f-ed in the head and should just check themselves into an institution sooner rather than later. We're not talking about the Taliban leaders here, we're talking about professional athletes. Forget competitiveness, rivalries, fanbase vs. fanbase. Those kind of statements don't have a place in football. Go to England or Germany or South America and attend a soccer "match" and you'll see that type of behavior. American Football fans should know better. That's all I've been saying. Maybe the author of the PG article should have been more general in his statements, perhaps grabbing a few quotes from other message boards as well. Maybe it's his way of "sticking it" to the Bengals. I don't know. What I do know is, while many of you are defending yourselves you're ignoring the fact that you really do have some sick bastards in your midst.Delusional hypocrits Not only are they nieve enough to think Steelers fans are perfect, they blast Bengals fans for doing the same thing they did when Carson went down.What no one has said, is that just about NO ONE wished ill will towards Ben, but were merely pointing out the "Karma effect" on all Steelers fans that raided this board in January with screen names like "KimoTherapy" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierCat Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 More of the same from you. Defense mode in full swing, not even paying attention to the main theme of the article.Hilarious. CT has gone all the way from stating that the article was completely accurate to blathering vaguely about "main themes." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkendall Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Hey Denver, it's really ok. I love debating and talking and it's pretty hard to get me offended or anything; after all, I spent the last 3-4 days being berated by some Steelers fans and have had been on the receiving end of a HairOnFire rant. I think the soccer discussion is a good one and should be explored. But my concern over all this, is exactly what CT said. And let's be honest, SOME soccer fans overseas take their passion and debate to a level that I hope that never comes to pass in American sports -- which was my original point.Personally, I think it's time to consider a league wide ban over alcohol sales... seems to me that a few are completely destroying that enjoyment for millions. I would support that ban though..Sorry if I came off defensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duus Posted June 19, 2006 Report Share Posted June 19, 2006 Hey Denver, it's really ok. I love debating and talking and it's pretty hard to get me offended or anything; after all, I spent the last 3-4 days being berated by some Steelers fans and have had been on the receiving end of a HairOnFire rant. I think the soccer discussion is a good one and should be explored. But my concern over all this, is exactly what CT said. And let's be honest, SOME soccer fans overseas take their passion and debate to a level that I hope that never comes to pass in American sports -- which was my original point.Personally, I think it's time to consider a league wide ban over alcohol sales... seems to me that a few are completely destroying that enjoyment for millions. I would support that ban though..Sorry if I came off defensive.I think you make a great point. 'Passionate' is surely a term you may apply to Steeler fans as well. On one hand, you might normally find that to be a good thing, but in their case it is so over-the-top that it is unhealthy. I am not alone in this claim. As for me, I honestly never want to see the Bengal fanbase so screwed up that they set up vigils outside a hospital for a player that has already been shown to be 'fine'. I never want to see my fanbase tailgating at a hospital for a football player. I never want my fanbase throwing their trash on our QBs lawn because he had a bad game. I never want my fanbase to threaten old ladies that make a wrong turn in a car. Passionate? No ... just skewed reality. It's a religion ... and they are proud of that. I don't want that. I want a football team. But at the end of Sunday, I want to know that my wife, kids, and so forth are far, far more important. But when the colors of black and gold (uh, yellow) are your gods, then what do you expect. I sort of like it that way, at least while I live here. When they lose, man is it fun to see how sad they are. I often think that with every loss, they lose another year off their collective lives ... and that, sir, is a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denverbengal Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 Hey Denver, it's really ok. I love debating and talking and it's pretty hard to get me offended or anything; after all, I spent the last 3-4 days being berated by some Steelers fans and have had been on the receiving end of a HairOnFire rant. I think the soccer discussion is a good one and should be explored. But my concern over all this, is exactly what CT said. And let's be honest, SOME soccer fans overseas take their passion and debate to a level that I hope that never comes to pass in American sports -- which was my original point.Personally, I think it's time to consider a league wide ban over alcohol sales... seems to me that a few are completely destroying that enjoyment for millions. I would support that ban though..Sorry if I came off defensive.It's all good Josh. I think the World Cup has me a little on edge. It's such a great sporting event, and sometimes I think I get a little frustrated that other Americans don't enjoy it as much as I do. I definitely agree that allot of international soccer fans take things a little too far, to put it mildly . I certainly wouldn't want anything resembling a soccer riot taking place at any football game. And alcohol is the major contributing factor to both soccer riots and unruly football fans. I'm no prude by any means, but a ban on alcohol sales at football games doesn't seem like a bad idea (too bad there's no legal alternative). I have tickets to the Bengals-Broncos game on Christmas Eve. I've never been to a football game in an opposing team's stadium, and I fully intend to support my team in a respectful way. But the thought of getting my a$$ kicked by some drunk idiots after we win , simply because I'm wearing a Bengals jersey does concern me a bit...especially if they're drunk Bronco fans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsbengalsbucks Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 Soccer is a sport only in name for me, it is boring to watch and I could not care less about it.It does rank above golf and bowling in watchability.Football is the only sport that I can watch on TV with out becoming bored out of my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 I think soccer is a lot like hockey in the fact that if you don't know the ins and outs of the game, it's boring to watch. I don't know sh*t about hockey outside of getting the puck into the opponents net and the whole concept bores the living sh*t out of me. Soccer on the other hand intrigues me because I DO know the ins and outs and have been playing since I was 5 years old. Thus, the more you know and are aware, the more interesting it is. Well, at least in this instance...WHODEY !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CT Stiller Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 In my opinion, you take a team's fanbase's behavior way too seriously and way too personally. I am disgusted by the idiots who made comments about Ben's accident, but I don't look at all of you and other Bengals fans as idiots because of a few morons. You say you don't want fellow Cinci fans to get to the level that Steelers fans get to, which is fine. But does it really matter what a few extreme fans do? I love my team but ignore the few fans who do stupid things, because what the hell do they mean to me? They don't make me, personally, look bad. I think you need to get past other teams' fans' behavior and concentrate more on your own team and stop putting your fellow fans on a pedestal. And even though it's beside the point, none of the claims about the woman receiving death threats and Maddox having his lawn vandalized have been substatiated. The media loves to blow things out of proportion and it's only a few weeks or months later that people find out the truth about such incidents, and by then everyone's made up their mind.I think you make a great point. 'Passionate' is surely a term you may apply to Steeler fans as well. On one hand, you might normally find that to be a good thing, but in their case it is so over-the-top that it is unhealthy. I am not alone in this claim. As for me, I honestly never want to see the Bengal fanbase so screwed up that they set up vigils outside a hospital for a player that has already been shown to be 'fine'. I never want to see my fanbase tailgating at a hospital for a football player. I never want my fanbase throwing their trash on our QBs lawn because he had a bad game. I never want my fanbase to threaten old ladies that make a wrong turn in a car. Passionate? No ... just skewed reality. It's a religion ... and they are proud of that. I don't want that. I want a football team. But at the end of Sunday, I want to know that my wife, kids, and so forth are far, far more important. But when the colors of black and gold (uh, yellow) are your gods, then what do you expect. I sort of like it that way, at least while I live here. When they lose, man is it fun to see how sad they are. I often think that with every loss, they lose another year off their collective lives ... and that, sir, is a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duus Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 And even though it's beside the point, none of the claims about the woman receiving death threats and Maddox having his lawn vandalized have been substatiated. The media loves to blow things out of proportion and it's only a few weeks or months later that people find out the truth about such incidents, and by then everyone's made up their mind.Wrong. I personally spoke to Maddox myself (spoke at a men's meeting at my church in Pittsburgh) soon after this happened. It DID OCCUR. Once again ... denial. Excuses. You are missing the point. I do know that you will always have the 'few fans' that do stupid things. I accept that. With the Steelers fans it's a far bigger proportion. In fact, I go as far as to say that due to this team becoming a religion it might even now be a majority of its fanbase. Maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but it's becoming more and more a fact. Again, I know so many fans of other teams in Pittsburgh and the very first thing out of their mouths when they discover I am not 'a Steeler fan' is how over-the-top obnoxious and filled with hate these people are. This occurred recently at my physical therapy when the head therapist (a Bronco fan) learned I was a Bengal fan. I had not said a word to him. This happened again at a picnic over Memorial Day when I met a Niner fan. It happened in California last month when I was on business. Sitting at a bar watching basketball and the guy next to me asked me where I was from. I told him that I flew in from Pittsburgh. He grew silent. Then I mentioned I was a Bengal fan, and boy did he go on and on about the handful of Steeler fans he has run into over the years. Another guy over Christmas told me about a 'semi-formal' business gathering he was at where these Steeler fans in the group caused so much trouble at the conference that they were forced to leave. Yeah, this happens in every fanbase. Don't let the facts get in the way of your perspective, CT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 ...and have had been on the receiving end of a HairOnFire rant. And you lived through it, right? Thus, your scars are a badge of honor. More importantly, in all of our swapping I've never once lost respect for you, even when I disagreed your opinions in the strongest possible way. And the reason I never lost that critical level of respect is because I always believed your opinions to be genuine. And there lies the critical difference between you and our visiting hypocrite, CT Stiller. For all of his hand wringing and whines of protest I can't seem to forget that when Palmer was injured, and the rest of his career was in doubt, CT claimed that the Bengals actually benefited from his injury. So who thinks he's stupid enough to actually believe that? Who thinks he was just making excuses for the way the Steelers won that playoff game? Who thinks he considered and then promptly ignored the insensitivity of his remarks? And who thinks he's attempting to rationalize and downplay those remarks now? My hand is raised on all counts. Last, let's not forget that our boy CT has repeatedly visited this board for prolonged periods of time only when these types of events are playing out. Well, how many of us have bothered visiting a Steeler board the last week? I haven't. Bottom Line: My gut tells me that CT Stiller likes to act like a drama queen, forever playing the wronged victim when it suits him, and hoping that everyone forgets the day when he wore an asshat that fit his head perfectly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted June 20, 2006 Report Share Posted June 20, 2006 I think you make a great point. 'Passionate' is surely a term you may apply to Steeler fans as well. On one hand, you might normally find that to be a good thing, but in their case it is so over-the-top that it is unhealthy. I am not alone in this claim. As for me, I honestly never want to see the Bengal fanbase so screwed up that they set up vigils outside a hospital for a player that has already been shown to be 'fine'. I never want to see my fanbase tailgating at a hospital for a football player. I never want my fanbase throwing their trash on our QBs lawn because he had a bad game. I never want my fanbase to threaten old ladies that make a wrong turn in a car. Passionate? No ... just skewed reality. It's a religion ... and they are proud of that. I don't want that. You're right, you aren't alone in that claim. The Pittsburgh talk show host that was on the Dan Patrick Show the day after the accident repeatedly made the point that Steeler fans are unique in the way that they inject themselves into every event concerning the Steelers. When Patrick responded that this was just a sign of their passion the sports show host from Pittsburgh agreed, but then quickly pointed out how little compassion and real concern was being shown by Steeler fans to Ben. He claimed that almost all of the concern being expressed was about how the team would be impacted in the short and long term. In conclusion he actually claimed that the level of passion that defines the Steeler fanbase is unhealthy. Or if you prefer, sick. And he should know, right? After all, he observes their behavior everyday. Frankly, I bet he isn't the least bit surprised that an element of SteelerNation has seen fit to threaten an old woman. I'd say that most observers would argue that it was predictable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jditty47 Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 shrink the soccer field, allow more contact, take off the offsides s**t, and then mb then soccer might get more interesting to americans. soccer is flat out boring to watch. yay lets kick a ball 3 miles down a field so we can get it stolen so the other team can take the ball 3 miles the other way before getting it stolen and then etc etc. 90 min with a 0-0 score is ridiculous. and army im glad u only compared soccer to hockey in the sense that u must know the ins and outs. honestly either of them is the same...soccer should allow fights like hockey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmyBengal Posted June 21, 2006 Report Share Posted June 21, 2006 I just love the sport, but as I said, I've been playing it forever...Fighting in soccer would be great !!! The bad part is the fans would end up rushing the field and it would be absoultely out of control !!!WHODEY !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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