Roush-Hendricks-Roush-Hendricks-Roush-Hendricks

[BengalszoneBilly]

These two teams OWN Nascar! Dodge saw a glimpse when Kahne won, but that now seems as though it was a fluke! It sure gives creedence to the "Big Team = Big Results" theory. If I was a single or two car team, I'd be looking long and hard at a merger right now!

[StripesNTn]

Well my thouights are it proves my point that teams need to be limited to 3 cars not 4-5.

Besides odds being o nthere side al lthe shared testing is a great advantage.

[kevnz]

Well my thouights are it proves my point that teams need to be limited to 3 cars not 4-5.

Besides odds being o nthere side al lthe shared testing is a great advantage.

Actually, Owners are limited to 2 teams already. The way they get around it have other people listed on the entry. Mark Martin owns the 17 team for instance. I think Hendricks brother is listed as the owner of some of the teams. People make a big deal about the big multicar teams but really, when you look at the stats only two of the Hendrick drivers have won a race, and only three of the Roush drivers have won a race. Other teams lean heavily on Roush and Hendricks. The Yates teams have the same engines, and the Wood Brothers are basically the 6th Roush team. And with the Hendricks the 10/01/36 use their engines. I think one of the most over looked aspects is the fact that All the Roush drivers like their cars loose, and that plays into the new spoiler rule. But a lot of teams haven't adjusted well to the new rule (see Dale Jr). As for Gordon and Johnson, they are gonna win no matter what as long as they have good equipment. Plus you have to look as some of the luck the other teams have had that had it not happened may have changed the outcome of a race or two.

[BengalszoneBilly]

Well my thouights are it proves my point that teams need to be limited to 3 cars not 4-5.

Besides odds being o nthere side al lthe shared testing is a great advantage.

Actually, Owners are limited to 2 teams already. The way they get around it have other people listed on the entry. Mark Martin owns the 17 team for instance. I think Hendricks brother is listed as the owner of some of the teams. People make a big deal about the big multicar teams but really, when you look at the stats only two of the Hendrick drivers have won a race, and only three of the Roush drivers have won a race. Other teams lean heavily on Roush and Hendricks. The Yates teams have the same engines, and the Wood Brothers are basically the 6th Roush team. And with the Hendricks the 10/01/36 use their engines. I think one of the most over looked aspects is the fact that All the Roush drivers like their cars loose, and that plays into the new spoiler rule. But a lot of teams haven't adjusted well to the new rule (see Dale Jr). As for Gordon and Johnson, they are gonna win no matter what as long as they have good equipment. Plus you have to look as some of the luck the other teams have had that had it not happened may have changed the outcome of a race or two.

So that's why Jack Roush's wife owns the #97 car.

[Kirkendall]

Yea, I think Rick Hendrick owns the 5 and 25 while Jeff Gordon is listed as the owner for the 24 and 48 cars.

I had no idea about the two team rule though. Good to know.

[TonyFan20]

DEI and JGR should do what Roush and Yates did. Both organizations are struggling now. Tony seems to be the only one to run up front and Mikey as well. Tony gets along great with Jr and Mikey and im sure Bobby and Jason could get along with Jr and Mikey.

[Kirkendall]

DEI and JGR should do what Roush and Yates did. Both organizations are struggling now. Tony seems to be the only one to run up front and Mikey as well. Tony gets along great with Jr and Mikey and im sure Bobby and Jason could get along with Jr and Mikey.

I agree with you Tony. I think there should be more alliences if big-team organizations is the way. The minimal team deal really doesn't make sense anyway since owners get around it, as Kev said.

However, Marty Smith attacked that in his Last Lap column today on NASCAR.com.

Here's the question posed to Marty.

20Stewart02: My question is: With the two super teams of Hendrick and Roush, would it be prudent for maybe Gibbs and DEI to join forces and try and put an engine/car program together to make those two teams better? Once upon a time, JGR was considered one of the cream of the crop teams, and now they are just mediocre.

Stewart is the only one with any "success" this year, and that's without a win. Bobby (Labonte) and Jason (Leffler) both have had awful luck, if any, and it just seems as if DEI can't put together consistency with Jr., and Mikey (Waltrip) is showing some improvement, but not the performance that one would expect from DEI.

Should these two teams merge to form another "super team" to counter the Hendrick and Roush organizations and dominance for the past couple of years?

Here's Marty's response.

I'm uncertain that would work, Smoke. It's all about information gathering and an open notebook. Yes, resources are crucial, and the Yates/Roush engine program is standing proof that pooling resources among manufacturers is a viable option.

But all the resources in the world are useless without the proper information to activate them.

Think about Elliott Sadler and Dale Jarrett for a moment. They have the very same engines that Greg Biffle and Carl Edwards have, but they aren't reeling off victories. (Which also prompts me to wonder what's up with the No. 17 team? Matt Kenseth's last top-five finish came last September at New Hampshire, a span of 23 races. Wow.)

Back to Yates. They don't have the ability to test a car at every single venue on the circuit. Roush does. Each team is allotted five tests, and rookies get even more.

So while Yates has just 10 tests at their disposal, Roush has more than 25. There are 22 total tracks on the Nextel Cup circuit. And Roush is willing to share the information gathered company-wide. That doesn't seem fair. That's why there is a sense of urgency at Yates to add a third Cup team.

That's why Gibbs added a third Cup team. Gibbs and DEI would have to be willing to open an almost sacred line of communication. They'd have to allow engineers from rival organizations to pore over their machines and data.

That's like opening your financial records to your neighbor.

[TonyFan20]

I don't really agree with Marty. I mean yeah sure they would be sharing their info but in the long run i think it would greatly help DEI and Gibbs. And im sure the drivers wouldn;t mind it either.

[BengalszoneBilly]

I don't really agree with Marty. I mean yeah sure they would be sharing their info but in the long run i think it would greatly help DEI and Gibbs. And im sure the drivers wouldn;t mind it either.

I agree. Marty missed it on this one. Data is data, and the more you have, the better off you are. Especially in Nascar!

[kevnz]

I don't really agree with Marty. I mean yeah sure they would be sharing their info but in the long run i think it would greatly help DEI and Gibbs. And im sure the drivers wouldn;t mind it either.

I agree. Marty missed it on this one. Data is data, and the more you have, the better off you are. Especially in Nascar!

Okay, suppose you share your data with another team, then you lose to that other team. What does that do for your sponsers, or your team? Are they splitting any of the winners money? The only way "team up" would work would be either have a manufacturer step in and help facilitate it (that's what happened with the Yates-Roush engine team-up, Ford made it happen, Jack and Robert don't actually like each other very much, even recently, Roush went to Robert with an offer to buy RYR and Robert told him to take it and shove it up his....hat) the other way would be a full on merger.

Also what good is sharing data if you use different chassis? That's another thing that has helped Roush and Hendrick, they now have a common chassis between the teams instead of having the 6 team make theirs and the 99 team make another type of chassis so any data gathered helps everyone. Plus all the Roush drivers have a similar prefrence for setups (they all like them loose). Not sure about the Hendricks teams though.

Also, a few years back DEI and Childress and I think another team gathered together to share data....It didn't help....

[Kirkendall]

I think the testing issue is a big-hit no one's talking about. 25 tests for Roush and only, for example 10 for DEI? Shesh!

[kevnz]

I think the testing issue is a big-hit no one's talking about. 25 tests for Roush and only, for example 10 for DEI? Shesh!

Testing is huge, one reason teams like adding a rookie, they get more tests. NASCAR Needs to do more to eliminate testing. Either have a mandatory test session like they do for Daytona and Talladega and not allow testing any other time, or allow teams to arrive a day earlier at a track and let them have a whole day before the racing starts to test. That would help eliminate a big expense as well, team owners would only pay for one more day of having the team at a race, not several days and extra expenses of sending them their to begin with.

But, just because they can't practice at a track on the schedule doesn't prevent them from testing at other tracks. Teams are always going to V.I.R. (in my hometown at that) to test for road course racing, so doing away with testing dates would only slow the problem down.