2 picks for Rudi?

[shworge]

Rudi is following closely in Priest Holmes pattern. Holmes didn't have his first good year until his 5th season. Since then, he has had over 1400 yards every year. Rudi is going into his 5th year next year. He is at the age where he's getting a handle on the teams he plays each year, and will only continue to get better. Baltimore gave up on Holmes and let him go to KC in his 5th season by the way. Do we really want to let Rudi go and create the next Priest Holmes in another uniform?

Rudi's YPC over his career is the same as LTs, just not as many attempts over his career. LT has averaged over 100 more carries a season in his first 3 seasons than Rudi has. Go figure, his overall yardage, TDs, 1st downs, etc. are greater. Give Rudi as many chances to run over that period, and I think he WOULD be the equal of LT in stats.

Cokeboy: Hey, he might be the best running back in the league, explaining why Baltimore didn't keep Priest around. However, I don't think Perry can pull a Jamal in replacing Rudi. Besides, I'd rather have a character guy like Rudi than a coke dealer like Jamal on our roster.

Rudi IS one of the top 10 backs in the league. He is #6 in the league in rushing yardage this season, #11 in rushing touchdowns (and our offense hasn't been all that great this season), he's #7 in the league in yards per attempt among starters too.

Rudi is 25 freaking years old! He will get better and has at least 5 more good years in him. Letting him go would be a mistake. If we pay $4 million a year or even $5 million a year, he's worth every penny.

Priest Holmes and Ladanian Tomlinson are also great receivers out of the backfield. Last year alone LT had over 1,000 yards receiving plus all his rushing yards. I can't believe you guys are actually comparing Rudi to these two guys. Rudi is a decent runner when running between the tackles but can't run outside and can't catch out of the backfield.

[FonzieDog]

I think one of the reasons some people are not interested in keeping Rudi is he isn't as flashy as a Holmes, LT, Ahman, or Tiki. He's not a major threat to break an 80 yard touchdown run/reception and you will rarely see a Rudi highlight on sportscenter. However, numbers don't lie. He has been one of the most productive backs since he's become a starter in the league. His stats sneak up on you. You see his stats in the 3rd/4th quarter and you are surprised to see him closing in on 100 yards. He grinds it out and gets his ugly four yards. Do you really want to let that go?

I think Rudi and Perry (when healthy) could compliment each other well on the same roster. Depth at a skill position (any position) is never a bad thing. I don't want to see what would happen next year if we let Rudi go and Perry gets injured. We'd have Kenny Watson as our feature back and we'd be scrambling to find out if Brandon Bennett is available. Maybe not Brandon Bennett but you get what I'm saying. Just ask the Steelers if they are happy they had two 1st string caliber running backs on their roster.

[jditty47]

I think one of the reasons some people are not interested in keeping Rudi is he isn't as flashy as a Holmes, LT, Ahman, or Tiki.  He's not a major threat to break an 80 yard touchdown run/reception and you will rarely see a Rudi highlight on sportscenter.  However, numbers don't lie.  He has been one of the most productive backs since he's become a starter in the league.  His stats sneak up on you.  You see his stats in the 3rd/4th quarter and you are surprised to see him closing in on 100 yards.  He grinds it out and gets his ugly four yards.  Do you really want to let that go?

I think Rudi and Perry (when healthy) could compliment each other well on the same roster.  Depth at a skill position (any position) is never a bad thing.  I don't want to see what would happen next year if we let Rudi go and Perry gets injured.  We'd have Kenny Watson as our feature back and we'd be scrambling to find out if Brandon Bennett is available.  Maybe not Brandon Bennett but you get what I'm saying.  Just ask the Steelers if they are happy they had two 1st string caliber running backs on their roster.

any rb that would get rudi's numbers in our system would have his type of numbers. His numbers arent good at all. A great or above average runningback would blow his numbers out of the water with the amount of carries he gets.

[jditty47]

Rudi is following closely in Priest Holmes pattern.  Holmes didn't have his first good year until his 5th season.  Since then, he has had over 1400 yards every year.  Rudi is going into his 5th year next year.  He is at the age where he's getting a handle on the teams he plays each year, and will only continue to get better.  Baltimore gave up on Holmes and let him go to KC in his 5th season by the way.  Do we really want to let Rudi go and create the next Priest Holmes in another uniform?

Rudi's YPC over his career is the same as LTs, just not as many attempts over his career.  LT has averaged over 100 more carries a season in his first 3 seasons than Rudi has.  Go figure, his overall yardage, TDs, 1st downs, etc. are greater.  Give Rudi as many chances to run over that period, and I think he WOULD be the equal of LT in stats.

Cokeboy:  Hey, he might be the best running back in the league, explaining why Baltimore didn't keep Priest around.  However, I don't think Perry can pull a Jamal in replacing Rudi.  Besides, I'd rather have a character guy like Rudi than a coke dealer like Jamal on our roster.

Rudi IS one of the top 10 backs in the league.  He is #6 in the league in rushing yardage this season, #11 in rushing touchdowns (and our offense hasn't been all that great this season), he's #7 in the league in yards per attempt among starters too. 

Rudi is 25 freaking years old!  He will get better and has at least 5 more good years in him.  Letting him go would be a mistake.  If we pay $4 million a year or even $5 million a year, he's worth every penny.

Priest Holmes and Ladanian Tomlinson are also great receivers out of the backfield. Last year alone LT had over 1,000 yards receiving plus all his rushing yards. I can't believe you guys are actually comparing Rudi to these two guys. Rudi is a decent runner when running between the tackles but can't run outside and can't catch out of the backfield.

yep, bad comparison, good point shworge.

[FonzieDog]

I think one of the reasons some people are not interested in keeping Rudi is he isn't as flashy as a Holmes, LT, Ahman, or Tiki.  He's not a major threat to break an 80 yard touchdown run/reception and you will rarely see a Rudi highlight on sportscenter.  However, numbers don't lie.  He has been one of the most productive backs since he's become a starter in the league.  His stats sneak up on you.  You see his stats in the 3rd/4th quarter and you are surprised to see him closing in on 100 yards.  He grinds it out and gets his ugly four yards.  Do you really want to let that go?

I think Rudi and Perry (when healthy) could compliment each other well on the same roster.   Depth at a skill position (any position) is never a bad thing.  I don't want to see what would happen next year if we let Rudi go and Perry gets injured.  We'd have Kenny Watson as our feature back and we'd be scrambling to find out if Brandon Bennett is available.  Maybe not Brandon Bennett but you get what I'm saying.  Just ask the Steelers if they are happy they had two 1st string caliber running backs on their roster.

any rb that would get rudi's numbers in our system would have his type of numbers. His numbers arent good at all. A great or above average runningback would blow his numbers out of the water with the amount of carries he gets.

How do you rank Corey Dillon? Would you say he is/was great or above average? In Rudi's last 16 games he has 1,344 yards. Dillon had more yards than that only once in his career at Cincinnati. Dillon never had more than 10 TDs in a year and Rudi is right there with 11 in his last 16. Rudi's numbers at the end of this year figure to be right on par with Dillon's best year in Cincinnati. I thought Dillon was a pretty great back but I don't think his numbers blow Rudi's out of the water. Since Rudi has taken over there hasn't been hardly any drop in production from that position.

[oldschooler]

Rudi is following closely in Priest Holmes pattern.  Holmes didn't have his first good year until his 5th season.  Since then, he has had over 1400 yards every year.  Rudi is going into his 5th year next year.  He is at the age where he's getting a handle on the teams he plays each year, and will only continue to get better.  Baltimore gave up on Holmes and let him go to KC in his 5th season by the way.  Do we really want to let Rudi go and create the next Priest Holmes in another uniform?

Rudi's YPC over his career is the same as LTs, just not as many attempts over his career.  LT has averaged over 100 more carries a season in his first 3 seasons than Rudi has.  Go figure, his overall yardage, TDs, 1st downs, etc. are greater.  Give Rudi as many chances to run over that period, and I think he WOULD be the equal of LT in stats.

Cokeboy:  Hey, he might be the best running back in the league, explaining why Baltimore didn't keep Priest around.  However, I don't think Perry can pull a Jamal in replacing Rudi.  Besides, I'd rather have a character guy like Rudi than a coke dealer like Jamal on our roster.

Rudi IS one of the top 10 backs in the league.  He is #6 in the league in rushing yardage this season, #11 in rushing touchdowns (and our offense hasn't been all that great this season), he's #7 in the league in yards per attempt among starters too. 

Rudi is 25 freaking years old!  He will get better and has at least 5 more good years in him.  Letting him go would be a mistake.  If we pay $4 million a year or even $5 million a year, he's worth every penny.

Priest Holmes and Ladanian Tomlinson are also great receivers out of the backfield. Last year alone LT had over 1,000 yards receiving plus all his rushing yards. I can't believe you guys are actually comparing Rudi to these two guys. Rudi is a decent runner when running between the tackles but can't run outside and can't catch out of the backfield.

Who cares about what LT did last year ?

What was his teams record ?

THIS YEAR LT has rushed the ball 237 times for 899 yards.

He has caught the ball 38 times for 315 yards.

He has touched the ball 275 times and has a total of 1214 yards.

He is averaging 4.4 yards every time he touches the ball.

THIS YEAR Rudi has rushed 248 times for 1049 yards.

He has 10 catches for 33 yards.

He has touched the ball 258 times for 1082 yards.

Rudi is averaging 4-1 yards everytime he touches the ball.

Rudi has a better average per carry than LT.

Rudi is averaging a half a yard more per carry...4.2 compared

to LT`s 3.8.

LT is on a team that`s QB has 21 TD`s and 3 INT`s.

Teams are playing the run more against the Bengals than they are

against the Chargers.

Like it or not Rudi does compare to LT yardage wise anyway.

LT gets the ball thrown to him more is all.

[bengalboomer7]

Do you even watch the games jditty. I agree with you that he is not yet(keyword ther yet) one of the elite backs in this leaue. But he's 25 years old and it's his first year as a full time starter and his numbers contradict everything you've said. He never gets hurt. Sure I'll give you the fact he's had only one really great game this year but don't forget the three 150 games last year and Corey never did that. He is close to one of the top ten backs now and in two years who knows.

[jditty47]

do i not watch the games? ya i watch the games.

1 Sep 12 @ NYJ L 24-31 23 67 2.9 16 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 1 1

2 Sep 19 MIA W 16-13 22 67 3.0 14 0 1 4 4.0 4 0 0 0

3 Sep 26 BAL L 9-23 23 98 4.3 19 0 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

4 Oct 3 @ PIT L 17-28 24 123 5.1 15 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

5 bye

6 Oct 17 @ CLE L 17-34 16 57 3.6 10 0 1 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

7 Oct 25 DEN W 23-10 24 119 5.0 36 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

8 Oct 31 @ TEN L 20-27 17 57 3.4 18 1 2 4 2.0 3 0 0 0

9 Nov 7 DAL W 26-3 26 95 3.7 8 0 4 19 4.8 8 0 0 0

10 Nov 14 @ WAS W 17-10 31 102 3.3 16 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 1 1

11 Nov 21 PIT L 14-19 16 62 3.9 15 0 1 1 1.0 1 0 0 0

12 Nov 28 CLE W 58-48 26 202 7.8 52 2 1 5 5.0 5 0 0 0

13 Dec 5 @ BAL

14 Dec 12 @ NWE

15 Dec 19 BUF

16 Dec 26 NYG

17 Jan 2 @ PHI

Total 248 1049 4.2 52 7 10 33 3.3 8 0 2 2

3 good games out of 11. gee, id love to have him back. look at those YPC wow, im impressed.

[Dewboy01]

Did anyone watch the last game?  Hello?

I agree completely! Hello, did you watch the last game? Rudi had over 200 yards rushing and looked like one of the best backs in the league. You don't let a guy who does that go, unless he's an asshat like Leon!

So based on the last game, we should sign Rudi to a multi-million dollar contract and what, just go without the upgrades to the defense that are needed? I agree that Rudi is a very good RB and could possibly continue to develop into a top 5 or top 10 back in the NFL. Again, I think our needs are more pressing on defense. If we (over)pay for Rudi and don't improve the defense....we will not be in any better shape next year then we are now. If we let Rudi go, start Perry and upgrade the defense...we will be a playoff contender without any doubt.

[bengalboomer7]

you forget to remember that we were playing catchup in five or six of those games and Rudi always does better in the second half

[bengalboomer7]

How do you know will be a playoff contender with a guy that has 1 career yard

[oldschooler]

do i not watch the games? ya i watch the games.

1 Sep 12 @ NYJ L 24-31 23 67 2.9 16 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 1 1

2 Sep 19 MIA W 16-13 22 67 3.0 14 0 1 4 4.0 4 0 0 0

3 Sep 26 BAL L 9-23 23 98 4.3 19 0 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

4 Oct 3 @ PIT L 17-28 24 123 5.1 15 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

5 bye

6 Oct 17 @ CLE L 17-34 16 57 3.6 10 0 1 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

7 Oct 25 DEN W 23-10 24 119 5.0 36 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0

8 Oct 31 @ TEN L 20-27 17 57 3.4 18 1 2 4 2.0 3 0 0 0

9 Nov 7 DAL W 26-3 26 95 3.7 8 0 4 19 4.8 8 0 0 0

10 Nov 14 @ WAS W 17-10 31 102 3.3 16 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 1 1

11 Nov 21 PIT L 14-19 16 62 3.9 15 0 1 1 1.0 1 0 0 0

12 Nov 28 CLE W 58-48 26 202 7.8 52 2 1 5 5.0 5 0 0 0

13 Dec 5 @ BAL

14 Dec 12 @ NWE

15 Dec 19 BUF

16 Dec 26 NYG

17 Jan 2 @ PHI

Total 248 1049 4.2 52 7 10 33 3.3 8 0 2 2

3 good games out of 11. gee, id love to have him back. look at those YPC wow, im impressed.

What you`re not taking into account is that teams were stacking up

to stop the run.

And that the Bengals had a VERY banged up line to start the season.

Rudi is the only RB to put up a 100 yards on the Steelers.

He has three 150 yard games and a 200 yard game in his 16 starts.

Plus we have been missing our BEST blocking WR all year. (Warrick)

[HoosierCat]

There's no doubt Rudi is a good RB. He's 6th in rushing yards right now, and 2nd in total attempts behind Martin. And ditty's right, that means his ypa stinks -- 15th out of the top 30 rushers (I don't say RBs because that includes Vick!). And whether you have to be a good receiver as an RB to be an elite back is debatable. I happen to think so, but you can point to Tomlinson (51st receiving among RBs) or good ol' Burger Boy (63rd, 1 spot ahead of Rudi), both of whom seem to be doing fine this year just hauling rocks.

Would I spend $4 million a year on Rudi? In a heartbeat. I'll give him a 5 year deal worth $20 million total, including a $5 million SB and salaries of $2, 2, 3, 4, and 4 million. Cost to let him go becomes less than the cost of keeping him in year 3, and I make the last two years voidable anyhow (hopefully Perry emerges). Cap hit for the first two years is $3 million each year, a mere $1.2 million more than we are paying now. And Rudi basically gets $9 million over the first two years. If you want to, tweak the third year down to 2 and put the extra million into the SB so he gets a cool $10 million in the first two years; cap effect is negligible.

$5 million? I can tweak the above to get there, maybe add a year. $6 million? OK, I think I'll put in a call to Edgerrin James and Shaun Alexander because if we're going to go that high maybe we should broaden our horizons...

[bengalboomer7]

As far as the financial aspect, I couldn't have put it any better myself.

[jditty47]

if we spend 4 million to a position that is already costing us whatever perry makes ill be pissed if its not alexander. rudi isnt worth the cap hit in my opinion. much more needs than rb.

[HoosierCat]

if we spend 4 million to a position that is already costing us whatever perry makes ill be pissed if its not alexander. rudi isnt worth the cap hit in my opinion. much more needs than rb.

Regarding Perry, he's costing us jack divided by sheot, ditty. We inked him to a $7 million, 5-year deal, so he's costing us $1.4 million in cap space avg./year, probably less right now because he's not hitting any incentives or escalators. If we signed Rudi to a $4 million/year deal, that means we'd have Rudi + Perry for about what we were paying for Corey Dillon. Personally, I'd be bloody thrilled with that.

[bengalboomer7]

that would be a pretty good combo even if Perry becomes nothing more than a good reciever out of the backfield. As long as the money is right Rudi should be a bengal, but only at probably 5 mill a year tops. As much as I would like it, we can't afford a guy like alexander but Rudi is more than enough and we would still have a little wiggle room to get a free agent or two(maybe?)

[Bobcat Bengal]

Can't we just convert Perry into a WR?

[Bobcat Bengal]

On the other hand. A durable player who isn't always injured is quite a valuable commodity. Perry has played 3 downs. He could be like Kijana in that aspect. Remember that?

You gotta LUV dem tharr Big Ten Backs!

Are ANY of them even doing s**t in the league?

Please refresh my memory for me.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

You know Terry, you're right, Eddie George sucked!

[FonzieDog]

You gotta LUV dem tharr Big Ten Backs!

Are ANY of them even doing s**t in the league?

Please refresh my memory for me.

Tyrone Wheatley and T.J. Duckett seem to be the best backs out of the Big Ten this year.

[chrishcovga]

According to the Bob Trumpy and Boomer Esiason show ( aired 12 -2 - 04) Contract talks have been going on just about all season.

* It appears Rudi is asking for a 4-5 mil a year type of deal. Cincy has proposed a deal very workable around the 4 or 5 year and 20-22 million dollar range.

- Also according to a " inside " source ( Bob Trumpy ) says Marvin has been quite adamant to the Browns about making sure he gets " his " players.

[HoosierCat]

According to the Bob Trumpy and Boomer Esiason show ( aired 12 -2 - 04) Contract talks have been going on just about all season.

* It appears Rudi is asking for a 4-5 mil a year type of deal. Cincy has proposed a deal very workable around the 4 or 5 year and 20-22 million dollar range.

- Also according to a " inside " source ( Bob Trumpy ) says Marvin has been quite adamant to the Browns about making sure he gets " his " players.

That's all very good news (assuming, of course, that Trumpy & Boomer have a clue). $20-22 million would be a good deal, and it even leaves a couple-three million to play with in negotiations. I think the big unknown is just how bad Rudi wants to test the market for a big payday. If he's serious about wanting to be a Bengal, then $20-25 million should be very doable. If he really wants to go fishing...well, we just won't see a deal before March 2005.

[Jonboat]

Now there is an economic breaking point.... which is why I think it would be smart to at least throw a modest offer out on the table now....  It will only get worse as the season goes on and his numbers and all the hype increase.....  Put something on the table now for them to chew on....  He just might take it....

They already did, Rudi turned down the offer. Hence the Perry Pick. Rudi's agent expects to break the bank for Rudi. He kinda has a point, cause Rudi will be the youngest Free Agent RB in history. But it should be a slightly crowded market at RB this year with S Alexander, J Lewis (who will probably be tagged) Edgerrin James, and Travis Henry along with Rudi, so that hurts his bargaining postition a bit. Plus it looks like a team like Miami and Oakland who both need a good RB will be drafting high enough to get one. It's gonna be interesting.

But Rudi could have very well signed to be a Bengal for Life, like his agent claims he wants to be, last year but said no, so let's not act like he's some super duper team first player. He had the chance to be the man, get his payday and help the team (do you really think that Perry would have been drafted if Rudi signed long term? A RB would have been drafted by the 3rd round, but not in the first) But he said no," I want more" (or at least his agent said that) Besides, everyone loves to blame Palmer for the Jets game and the Titans game cause of his turnovers late trying to bring the team back, but truth be known Rudi fumbled twice for touchdowns in those games and put Palmer in that postition. So people like to say Rudi doesn't fumble, or Rudi hasn't been injured....Well no kidding, he hasn't had the ball that much until this year so those sorta things are very misleading.

You're right he did turn down a contract offer & I believe that was the reason Perry was picked in the 1rst rnd. I was very upset at the pick until I learned of that & read his agent saying he's leaning towards FA. I love Rudi & personally hope they sign him & I believe they will offer a fair deal . The bottom line is it boils down to what he wants. I don't put much faith into players comments during the season, when they say they want to stay with a team, they're happy here ect., when they're in a FA year I mean come on what else are they going to say? Plus as we all know MONEY TALKS !!! GO BENGALS!!! Jonboat

[semiotter]

O.M.G How can you guys think to let RUDI GO!!! He doesnt BITCH or MOAN, He plays hard and wants to P L A Y for the BENGALS!! Plus he is a pretty good back.Plus MARVIN wants him. So I sign him he is a good team player and fits into MARVINS plans just right...