I blame Boomer and Dillon

[Sea Ray]

Oh, I thought Akili went second. Oh well, I still say Mikey would've picked Leaf if we were in that spot....

I agree

[HairOnFire]

Oh, I thought Akili went second. Oh well, I still say Mikey would've picked Leaf if we were in that spot....

I agree

Are you two still yammering about the mistakes you're dead certain Mike Brown would have made in an imaginary world?

[HoosierCat]

now, 2008 had the whip-marks of an SoP draft...

No argument.

One takes the good with the bad, right?

That said, I'd say the 2008 draft is defined by the greasy fingerprints and clown shoe footprints left by Ocho Stinko.

While I agree that 2008 was a standard-brand Bengals draft, I don't think you can point the finger at everyone's favorite whipping boy. Despite his antics, Chad was the one sure thing the team had at wideout. He was locked up for multiple years and his threat to sit out was a hollow one.

No, it was the mess that was the rest of the WR corps that propelled the '08 draft. Attempts by the Bengals to shore up the position with low-round projects (Bennie Brazell, Tab Perry, etc.) and second-tier FAs (Antonio Chatman) had all fizzled. Chris Henry, at the time of the 2008 draft, wasn't even on the team, having been cut about 3 weeks prior to the draft. And finally, as we now know, TJ Houshmandzadeh had rejected an extension, saying he was worth double what they were offering.

Unfortunately for the Bengals, the WR classes in the last few drafts, and this upcoming one, haven't been strong. So despite tossing a couple high picks and a boatload of FA dollars at the positon, things have continued to deteriorate. Which brings us back to the upcoming draft and the likelihood that at least one of our top two picks is a wideout. Given the Bengals' recent track record and the quality of the WR class this year, I'm not optimistic.

[Ickey44]

Oh, I thought Akili went second. Oh well, I still say Mikey would've picked Leaf if we were in that spot....

I agree

Are you two still yammering about the mistakes you're dead certain Mike Brown would have made in an imaginary world?

Is there some rule that we can't talk about what-if's? On another thread you keep pimping the possibility that Chad could/should be traded. In what imaginary world do you think THAT would happen in? You really think Mikey trades his favorite player?

[HairOnFire]

Is there some rule that we can't talk about what-if's?

Not at all. In fact, talking about the horrific mistakes that weren't made under imaginary scenarios that can no longer occur might just turn out to be the best use of your time.

On another thread you keep pimping the possibility that Chad could/should be traded. In what imaginary world do you think THAT would happen in?

Well, aren't you the silly one. Are you unaware that Chad could be traded? There's absolutely nothing related to reality that would prevent it. No counterfactual arguments need to be indulged. No need to go back in time. But most of all, no need for the both of you to ignore how, years later, Brown made the right choice when put in the very type of situation presented in your lets-whine-about-things-that-didn't-happen rant.

Palmer over Leftwich

[Ickey44]

Well, aren't you the silly one. Are you unaware that Chad could be traded? There's absolutely nothing related to reality that would prevent it. No counterfactual arguments need to be indulged.

So since you all about reality, how about the reality that Brown AND Marvin have said repeatedly over the years that Chad would not be traded. Yet you continue to go on and on about it like there's a chance it will happen. And while doing it you're doing the very thing you criticize others for.

[Sea Ray]

Are you two still yammering about the mistakes you're dead certain Mike Brown would have made in an imaginary world?

My comments regarding the Bengals and Ryan Leaf consisted of the two words you posted; hardly yammering in my book.

Your point is well taken that it was purely hypothetical but it's the off season and it beats talking about the price of website domain names and other subjects that come up around here this time of year

[HairOnFire]

So since you all about reality, how about the reality that Brown AND Marvin have said repeatedly over the years that Chad would not be traded.

Both men said the very same thing over and over and over agin whenever asked about trading Corey Dillon.

Yet you continue to go on and on about it like there's a chance it will happen.

See above.

Yet you continue to go on and on about it like there's a chance it will happen.

Again, the Bengals fought tooth and claw to keep Corey Dillon....and then immediately traded him when circumstances changed. And in regards to the Bengals passing game, with or without Chad, things have most certainly changed.

[HairOnFire]

My comments regarding the Bengals and Ryan Leaf consisted of the two words you posted; hardly yammering in my book.

I hereby withdraw my complaint, not because I believe it had no merit, but rather...because my words have triggered outrage amongst the local Mexican population.

[Pidge]

Bennie Brazell is playing Rugby these days for the Eagles by the by.

[Sea Ray]

I hereby withdraw my complaint, not because I believe it had no merit, but rather...because my words have triggered outrage amongst the local Mexican population.

Oh c'mon. Don't go getting all politically correct on us...

[HAPPYJAQ]

I agree with this.

In fact, with these guys having a full two seasons in the Bengals system, what looked to be a pretty strong draft on paper initially, might go down as one of the worst in recent history. The top 3 picks who have even contributed (Rivers, Sims and Caldwell) all looked to have maxed-out their potential. Rivers should be a solid starter for the Bengals, basically in the Brian Williams mold, and Caldwell looks like another Ron Dugans-type to me.

Brian Williams? You mean the NBC News anchor? Or maybe Brian Simmons, the LB from North Carolina?

Well, between 2002-07, Simmons had only 10 more NFL sacks than the NBC guy, so it's difficult to remember which one actually played for the Bengals without Googling. As the "name game" goes (and for the record), he did manage to achieve 11 more INTs over the same period than Richard Simmons.

Don't get me wrong, Rivers has shown flashes of being an above-average LB for the next decade or longer, but I just don't believe he'll ever be a guy that defenses have to gameplan around. I's say we would all prefer that out of a Top 10 pick. It hurts even more than a UFA that we got off the scrap heap from AZ has outplayed him at his position since Rivers has been here.

[HairOnFire]

It hurts even more than a UFA that we got off the scrap heap from AZ has outplayed him at his position since Rivers has been here.

Why the hurt? You claim Rivers looks to be an above average LB who could start for the next 10 years, and then quickly add a bit about a player the Bengals lifted from the scrap heap playing, in your opinion, even better. That smacks of a win/win situation...especially when you remember how desperate the Bengals were that day for younger, faster, healthier linebackers at nearly every position.

[Ickey44]

I hereby withdraw my complaint, not because I believe it had no merit, but rather...because my words have triggered outrage amongst the local Mexican population.

Oh c'mon. Don't go getting all politically correct on us...

He's not. That's sarcasm, which from him is normally funny. This time.......not so much.

[Sea Ray]

Don't get me wrong, Rivers has shown flashes of being an above-average LB for the next decade or longer, but I just don't believe he'll ever be a guy that defenses have to gameplan around. I's say we would all prefer that out of a Top 10 pick. It hurts even more than a UFA that we got off the scrap heap from AZ has outplayed him at his position since Rivers has been here.

I'd love to get that sort of defensive player with a top ten pick but honestly those guys aren't always available on draft day. An above avg player that starts for 7 years is about all you can expect.

I'm all about having realistic expectations and honestly the only defensive Pro Bowlers that came out of that draft were CBs. We can all agree that with Hall and Joseph, none of us wanted a CB with that pick.

So given all that, I think they did fine with Rivers