Chris Henry #2 WR?

[Sea Ray]

I admit my opinion is nothing more than an educated guess. Your opinion is not educated though. It's just a guess.

You claim that defenses fear Henry more than Coles because of his ability to catch the deep ball? Well, guess what. Coles also does that, but isn't a one-trick pony.

Did you know that in Henry's best season ('06) he only caught half of the passes he was targeted for? That's a lot of incompletions. Otherwise known as inconsistent. Yes, he caught a lot of TD's... but almost all of them inside the 20.

You are attempting to argue that Henry is a bigger threat anywhere on the field. But Coles has consistently been a viable deep threat, a good possession WR, a guy with dependable hands, and a player that can break big yards on a play designed for short yardage. Henry does only one of those things well.

Add to the argument... who is the best QB Coles has ever played with. Pennington? a 39 year old Favre? Coles is going to be more dangerous this year with a good QB throwing to him, and Chad taking away the double teams. Henry... he's always had Chad and Housh taking the focus off of him, and did nothing of note without Palmer in the lineup.

Alright. I'm done for now. That is plenty of evidence I've used to back up my opinion. You meanwhile offer no evidence and suggest that your hunch is just as valuable as my opinion. I disagree.

What makes yours "educated" and mine not? I think if you were "educated" you'd realize that Coles doesn't have the speed he once did. I think Chris Henry can make plays all over the field and I'll use two examples both from Steeler games.

The first one goes back to the final game of 2006 when Chris Henry made a huge catch in the waning seconds to put the Bengals in FG range. If not for Graham's shank that play would have led to a key win and the playoffs.

In the playoff game vs the Steelers on our first offensive play Carson completed a deep pass to Henry. Unfortunately both players were seriously injured on the play but I think those kinds of plays put more fear into Dick LeBeau than Coles or TJ catching a 3rd down pass over the middle.

You're entitled to your opinion but why do you go on and say your opinion has more merit than someone else's? That's pretty pompous if you ask me.

[Sea Ray]

Marvin Lewis recently commented on the fear of the big play:

I would expect those (downfield) plays to continue in the games as we go. Because otherwise, you don’t put any fear in the defense. When I was coaching defense, if I didn’t think the other team could go over our heads, well, we’d just keep doing what we do and pressing them up front.”

Q: Is there a reason you covet the big play so much?

ML: “When they strike up that band, you know? When that big bird drops the bomb on you (as a defense), you know it’s over, and they’re striking up the fight song. It’s a bad day, it’s a bad deal.

/>http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/marvin-lewis-press-conference-transcript/e130ee98-18c6-4b80-bef8-0093b33ccca8

Marvin knows what it takes to prepare a defense and he knows the downfield play is what puts fear in the defense. This threat is what Chris Henry brings to the team. This rare skill of his is why they've been so willing to put up with his off the field issues.

[Pidge]

Thing with Henry is, we already have him out on the field. A much better version in fact. If Chad Ochowickywackawacka plays up to his ability, the field is stretched. Underneath routes become open to be exploited if the deep route isn't on and it frees up space for the RBs to swing out into open field.

Coles > Henry over the middle. Surer hands and a bit sturdier when he takes the inevitable hits, IMO.

Henry is still one hell of a RZ threat zone thought, whether he's thrown to or not.

[derekshank]

Alright Sea Ray. I at least appreciate your use of evidence this time. I still disagree, but at least your attempting to defend your opinion with logic now.

Here's the thing though... and the main reason I disagree with you. Ted Ginn is a deep threat. How often is he useful? Not much, because every defense knows what he's going to do. Run straight. Until he develops other aspects to his game the pass will be incomplete or intercepted a high percentage of the time.

Chad is an incredible deep threat, but that's not even the best aspect of his game when he's trying. A good running game combined with those underneath possession catches are what opens up the deep ball. Henry on the field isn't much different than a TE that can't block. The defense knows the danger and can counter it. Until Henry become better at possession catches and route running, he'll never be better than Coles.

I'd also like to know how you know Coles has slowed... and even if he has, he was so fast, I'd bet he's still the fastest WR on the team, so the point is moot.

As for your Steelers story line, I'll see you and raise you another. The Bengals drive down the field with Rudi, Housh, and Chad. Inside the redzone Palmer spots a wide open Chris Henry in the endzone. The pass bounces through his hands, off his chest and to the ground. FG attempt failed. Wish it was the only time Henry has dropped easy an TD.

[Sea Ray]

Alright Sea Ray. I at least appreciate your use of evidence this time. I still disagree, but at least your attempting to defend your opinion with logic now.

Here's the thing though... and the main reason I disagree with you. Ted Ginn is a deep threat. How often is he useful? Not much, because every defense knows what he's going to do. Run straight. Until he develops other aspects to his game the pass will be incomplete or intercepted a high percentage of the time.

Chad is an incredible deep threat, but that's not even the best aspect of his game when he's trying. A good running game combined with those underneath possession catches are what opens up the deep ball. Henry on the field isn't much different than a TE that can't block. The defense knows the danger and can counter it. Until Henry become better at possession catches and route running, he'll never be better than Coles.

I'd also like to know how you know Coles has slowed... and even if he has, he was so fast, I'd bet he's still the fastest WR on the team, so the point is moot.

As for your Steelers story line, I'll see you and raise you another. The Bengals drive down the field with Rudi, Housh, and Chad. Inside the redzone Palmer spots a wide open Chris Henry in the endzone. The pass bounces through his hands, off his chest and to the ground. FG attempt failed. Wish it was the only time Henry has dropped easy an TD.

I honestly don't recall the dropped pass you mentioned but I will say Chris Henry is not known as one who drops many passes.

Let's hope you're right and Coles put great fear into opposing defenses. That would only mean good things for this offense.

[Baraka]

hunches/opinions? whats the difference?

Really? You don't know the difference? I fear for this country's future. It appears that public education is not what it used to be.

Alright. Dictionary.

A hunch is nothing more than a suspicion or a gut feeling.

An opinion is a judgment that merely lacks sufficient evidence to produce 100% certainty.

So... if I wanted to go test the stock market, who do I go to for advice? A fortune teller or a stockbroker? In your opinion, there is no difference.

you erased three important words from my original response that reveal my attitude toward this line of discussion.

[derekshank]

hunches/opinions? whats the difference?

Really? You don't know the difference? I fear for this country's future. It appears that public education is not what it used to be.

Alright. Dictionary.

A hunch is nothing more than a suspicion or a gut feeling.

An opinion is a judgment that merely lacks sufficient evidence to produce 100% certainty.

So... if I wanted to go test the stock market, who do I go to for advice? A fortune teller or a stockbroker? In your opinion, there is no difference.

you erased three important words from my original response that reveal my attitude toward this line of discussion.

Sorry to bore you by defining words that you use incorrectly. You do realize though, that no matter how useless you find the discussion, it's impossible to have an intelligent conversation if we aren't speaking the same language.

[derekshank]

I honestly don't recall the dropped pass you mentioned but I will say Chris Henry is not known as one who drops many passes.

Unfortunately I do recall not only that dropped pass... but several other rather easy catches. I also also remember plays that he gave up on too early that ended up incomplete or intercepted. Moreso I recall his inability to even get his hands on the ball when going over the middle because of his refusal to stretch out his arms for fear of being hit.

These are the reasons I assume that in his career he only catches 51% of the passes he is targeted for compared to Coles' 67%. These are also a few more reasons I assume that Coles is more feared than Henry.