Say it aint so...

[BZBot]

With Eric Steinbach’s arrest, now even this diehard Bengals fan is wondering if Coach Lewis has lost control, or if he even cares.

Source: http://www.bengalszone.com/article.php?sid=432

[bengal4life]

Dude, M. Lewis can't be every where all the time. If you think this is Marvin's fault than your retarded. Marvin can't help if one of his players wants to go out for a couple of bevies after work (Steinbech might have gotten a little out of hand) but sh*t who hasn't. Why do you think ol' Mikey is adding the "jerk" hotline. It's because most people act a little foolish while drinking. Granit he should have been a little more careful in his situation. I don't think this is nearly as bad as some of the other off field issues we've had happen this past off season. Since Steinbech didn't blow the breathalizer, he has more of a chance of getting off this charge or at least dropped to a lesser charge like maybe a reckless opperation. I also think the Cincinnati metropolitan area police follow Bengals players around just waiting for them to mess up. I mean it's inevitable (sarcasm).

[Kazkal]

He was freaking drinking well fishing omfg he should be put on death row.

[Kirkendall]

He was freaking drinking well fishing omfg he should be put on death row.

Fishing for what? Mutated sea monsters? People take showers in acid to clean themselves from the Ohio.

In all honesty, I think there's a collision of philosophy here.

In one corner you have those that believe Marvin should control the team and EVERYTHING they do. Control doesn't mean surveillance camera and phone taps, but, as Derek said in another thread, control is also defined by respecting your coach.

In the other corner, you have those that believe everyone should be held accountable for the simple fact these guys are adult men and no 45-year old man should be the mother of these guys. Coaches spend 100 hours a standard regular season week scouting the team and creating a game plan. If the players are unable to conduct themselves in a reasonable and respectful manner, then the full weight of public opinion and scolding is justified as well as the legal system running the course. After that, I don’t care. I want us to get 3rd and 1’s and beat the Clowns and the Stealers (who’ve enjoyed four arrests by three people so far).

Personally, I don't question the coach's role; they are doing a fine job with one 11-5 season under their hats. I question those that make these decisions (not grouping Steinbach in this) and why they don't respect their team-mates by keeping them out of this focus. But I doubt they worry about it too much. Afterall, it's a football team, not the Character Gentleman's Club of America; thank god.

[Kazkal]

Steelers had a recent arrest too their trying to follow in our steps

[kybengalsfan]

Dude, M. Lewis can't be every where all the time. If you think this is Marvin's fault than your retarded. Marvin can't help if one of his players wants to go out for a couple of bevies after work (Steinbech might have gotten a little out of hand) but sh*t who hasn't. Why do you think ol' Mikey is adding the "jerk" hotline. It's because most people act a little foolish while drinking. Granit he should have been a little more careful in his situation. I don't think this is nearly as bad as some of the other off field issues we've had happen this past off season. Since Steinbech didn't blow the breathalizer, he has more of a chance of getting off this charge or at least dropped to a lesser charge like maybe a reckless opperation. I also think the Cincinnati metropolitan area police follow Bengals players around just waiting for them to mess up. I mean it's inevitable (sarcasm).

By refusing to take a breath alcohol test, Steinbach will actually be in more trouble than if he did not. In Kentucky, he will lose his driver's license for six months for the refusal. It is a myth that your chances are better when you refuse. Also, it is absurd to believe the police are waiting around for the Bengals to mess up; with the money they make, it affords them the best legal counsel, and no cop want to be raked over the coals by an unscrupulous attorney. The police have better things to do. From what I understand, he is facing charges in Kentucky, so he was not arrested by the Cincinnati Police. Glad you check things out well

[chrishcovga]

For all you Bengal fans in Cincinnati, can someone up there please send Eric Steinbach some information on a lake here in Georgia called Lake Lanier.

It should be called Camp Crystal Lake, considering how many people die at this place every year. I mean it's like 20 people a year or more die at this place, and I'm not making that up, I'm for real. 20 or more people a year die at this lake, and for what reason are most accidental deaths caused by at this place....

That's right, Drinking while Boating.

[Kirkendall]

By refusing to take a breath alcohol test, Steinbach will actually be in more trouble than if he did not. In Kentucky, he will lose his driver's license for six months for the refusal.

Maybe. But Hobson clears that up a little..

Apparently the maximum punishment is $250 with no license suspension or jail time.

http://www.bengals.com/news/news.asp?story_id=5383

[schweinhart]

This is a whole different can of worms than Thurman, Henry, Frucker, Nicholson, etc.

It's the middle of camp for crissakes and Einsteiny should be made an example of. Don't eff up in the middle of camp whether it's on a boat, in a plane, train or car or involves a gun or a crack pipe. I'd like to see Marvin demote Einsteiny to 2nd team right now, not that he won't be the starter as soon as Carson is in.

[Kirkendall]

I disagree a little schweiny. The way I look at is is this isn't the military. It's a kids game played by men. I think the only harm this did was remind us of all the bigger issues we noted this off-season. I have no problem with Steinbach throwing back a few. As for the boat, look, I admit, I'm not a fisherman -- just a modern day pirate. I don't know much about boats or how fast/slow you have to be to Titanic someone's ass. But I also don't know if he was on a speedboat, or if he was just going at a really low knot (whatever knot is really really slow).

Am I being an apologist here? Perhaps. That's fine with me. I've only condemned Henry for multiple instances and Thurman for missing a quarter of the regular season. This, at least to me, is a none issue.

[aaronburr]

In Kentucky, he will lose his driver's license for six months for the refusal.

Does he have a Kentucky driver's license?

And are boating infractions really listed in the Kentucky vehicle code?

Seriously.

[schweinhart]

But I also don't know if he was on a speedboat, or if he was just going at a really low knot (whatever knot is really really slow).

I'd say if he was going really slow, he'd have been high rather than legally drunk and could've just said he was trolling.

But the water cops wouldn't pull a boat over in a no wake zone for going too slow, so Einsteiny had to be cruising, not necessarily flying though. Boating on the Ohio has some dicy moments at high speed because of debris slicks trapped at confluences after rains wash streams upriver and how quick swells from tug wakes can kick up even at a distance. You can hit either before you know it especially if there's any wave action at all on the water and you're on logs the size of trees in the troughs or about to get jolted or worse swamped by the big rolls that swell up behind the tugs.

Fishermen tend to enforce their own no wake zones when idiots fly by too close w/o regard for their wake. A 1-oz. spoon w/ barbed treble hook can be chucked over 100 yds with great effect. Nothing quite says slow down like a treble hook embedded in the scalp.

But as for the impact of Einsteiny's foray into water drunkery...this is training camp time -- the time when all the energy that leads into the season has to be focused w/o distraction so the coaches can get the team mindset in place to kick off the season. They can not let Einsteiny go w/o some consequence, even if it's token.

[The_Next_Big_Thing]

He was freaking drinking well fishing

While the water in the Ohio isn't much better than well water, or raw sewage for that matter, he was actually fishing in a place where fish might indeed be found.

As for "what is he going to catch", since when does fishing involve catching anything. It is called fishing, not catching. Fishing is about hanging out on water, relaxing with a beer, and having a good time. It is not about catching fish!

[bengal4life]

Dude, M. Lewis can't be every where all the time. If you think this is Marvin's fault than your retarded. Marvin can't help if one of his players wants to go out for a couple of bevies after work (Steinbech might have gotten a little out of hand) but sh*t who hasn't. Why do you think ol' Mikey is adding the "jerk" hotline. It's because most people act a little foolish while drinking. Granit he should have been a little more careful in his situation. I don't think this is nearly as bad as some of the other off field issues we've had happen this past off season. Since Steinbech didn't blow the breathalizer, he has more of a chance of getting off this charge or at least dropped to a lesser charge like maybe a reckless opperation. I also think the Cincinnati metropolitan area police follow Bengals players around just waiting for them to mess up. I mean it's inevitable (sarcasm).

By refusing to take a breath alcohol test, Steinbach will actually be in more trouble than if he did not. In Kentucky, he will lose his driver's license for six months for the refusal. It is a myth that your chances are better when you refuse. Also, it is absurd to believe the police are waiting around for the Bengals to mess up; with the money they make, it affords them the best legal counsel, and no cop want to be raked over the coals by an unscrupulous attorney. The police have better things to do. From what I understand, he is facing charges in Kentucky, so he was not arrested by the Cincinnati Police. Glad you check things out well

Are you on crack? Did you not see the (sarcasm) about cops following around players? I was joking, it just seems with every player getting in trouble recently that the cops are out for them. Your right I don't know much about Kentucky laws but in Ohio if you blow the breathalizer than that is more incriminating evidence against you. So your better off not blowing. You can also lose your license for a year in Ohio for not blowing but that is usually dropped after court. If Kentucky's laws are anything like Ohio's than he was better off not blowing. It is not a myth.

[schweinhart]

He was freaking drinking well fishing

While the water in the Ohio isn't much better than well water, or raw sewage for that matter, he was actually fishing in a place where fish might indeed be found.

As for "what is he going to catch", since when does fishing involve catching anything. It is called fishing, not catching. Fishing is about hanging out on water, relaxing with a beer, and having a good time. It is not about catching fish!

Contrary to popular opinion the whole Markland pool is loaded with all kinds of fish and fish can be found virtually anywhere in it. Obviously some places are better than others and knowing the difference involves skills more like hunting than kicking back with cold one and "fishing".

The idea of passive fishing, just hanging around and lopping a hook crammed with nightcrawlers over the side of the boat whilst drinking a beer, is most definitely enjoyable. But to people who fish actively -- ie lures with lots of casting or jigging for certain fish species -- there's really no time for kicking back with a cold one because it's all about catching fish.

For instance, boat fishermen used to be able to fish off the barge wall at Mehdahl dam where the lock and dam blocks the flow of water and creates almost like a rip current that backs up into itself from the other side of the dam where the wickets open to let water out of the pool above. There are concrete knobs set into the barge wall to tie off on and during the fall you can literally catch hundreds of saugers by jigging spoons heavy enough not to get lifted up by the current. When actively fishing like this there's not much time to drink beer or anything else other than jigging and taking fish off the hook.

Had Einsteiny been fishing there, he still may have been arrested since I don't think they let boaters do it any more because it can be hazardous getting off the wall in time after the water stops spilling through the gate and the barge is brought down to the lower pool level. But I'd applaud him if that's what he had gotten arrested for.

But the point here is that at some point I'd like to see the Bengals organization take an active position against these dumba$$es who get arrested for stupid crap. Rather than their passive, "We don't comment or take any action until the courts resolve these matters" BS, they really should take measures to deter players from idiocy --- most specifically during the middle of training camp. They need to start making examples of players that it is time for them to either fish or cut bait I'd like to see them demote Einsteiny for now to start turning their boat around on the issue of arrests and suspensions.

[redsbengalsbucks]

He was freaking drinking well fishing

While the water in the Ohio isn't much better than well water, or raw sewage for that matter, he was actually fishing in a place where fish might indeed be found

Well water, depending on the well in question can be the cleanest drinking water available. Most of the bottled water that you buy is well water with some treatment process to meet federal standards.

Dont confuse well water with dirty water in most cases it takes less treatment processes to make acceptable water from well water than any surface water source, no matter how clean or polluted it may be.

[HairOnFire]

But the point here is that at some point I'd like to see the Bengals organization take an active position against these dumba$$es who get arrested for stupid crap. Rather than their passive, "We don't comment or take any action until the courts resolve these matters" BS, they really should take measures to deter players from idiocy --- most specifically during the middle of training camp. They need to start making examples of players that it is time for them to either fish or cut bait I'd like to see them demote Einsteiny for now to start turning their boat around on the issue of arrests and suspensions.

Madness. I for one don't want the Bengals to surrender the ability to handle player arrests in exactly the same way as all other NFL tams do. Let the system do it's job while you suffer the ridiculous jabs from a hysterical media. In fact, it's about time the Bengals released a press statement that says...."Screw the media. You're not qualified to judge from a distance the behavior of players you know almost nothing about. So peddle your negative stories to a hand-wringing public, but your opinion means less than nothing to this organization. Your intent isn't to warn the public of whatever imagined danger you think it faces. Your intent is to sell newspapers and airtime, and nothing does that better than angry rants written for the expess intent of getting angry responses. Well that's all well and good on most days, but now we're talking about real people and their futures, so find another way to sell ad space for beer, Oldsmobiles, and shaving products."

And under no circumstance would I potentially poison Eric Steinbach's contract negotiations by taking ANY proactive steps that would be very correctly be seen as little more than an empty gesture offered to appease a strangely wigged out fanbase. You don't demote one of the best young guards in the NFL for going too fast in a no wake zone or for having too many beers during his free time. What you do is say as little as possible about it while offering the player whatever support you can.

[bengalboomer7]

See, I think you can blame marvin a tad on this one. Odell had documented character issues(I'm starting to hate this phrase) before he was drafted. Same with Henry, Nicholson, Brooks, and Rucker. hell, it's been reported that Cincy was offered info on Rucker and turned it down. Marvin, Mike, Katie and the lot can be blamed because they are the people that made the choice to draft these guys.

However, I absolutely agree that Marvin is not these guys daddies, and they are all adults who by now should know right from wrong. But all these guys had issues before they were Bengals, and we said "Come on Down" anyway.

[HairOnFire]

hell, it's been reported that Cincy was offered info on Rucker and turned it down.

Is this an issue? Aren't we talking about the Bengals refusing to pay a lawyer for information the NFL had already provided to all of the teams.

Wasn't ESPN the only buyer?

[Stripes]

Wasn't ESPN the only buyer?

Hell, they made the money back by the ratings it has gathered (thanks in part to Cheech's fun) from all the fans/message board posters watching.

[schweinhart]

But the point here is that at some point I'd like to see the Bengals organization take an active position against these dumba$$es who get arrested for stupid crap. Rather than their passive, "We don't comment or take any action until the courts resolve these matters" BS, they really should take measures to deter players from idiocy --- most specifically during the middle of training camp. They need to start making examples of players that it is time for them to either fish or cut bait I'd like to see them demote Einsteiny for now to start turning their boat around on the issue of arrests and suspensions.

And under no circumstance would I potentially poison Eric Steinbach's contract negotiations by taking ANY proactive steps that would be very correctly be seen as little more than an empty gesture offered to appease a strangely wigged out fanbase. You don't demote one of the best young guards in the NFL for going too fast in a no wake zone or for having too many beers during his free time. What you do is say as little as possible about it while offering the player whatever support you can.

First off, there doesn't seem to be any contract negotiations to poison, at least if Einsteiny's bloodsucker is true to his word. But if there were, maybe the Steinster could have invited Marv, Katie and Paul Alexander out for a day on the water and they could've all got Schiltzfaced together. I mean, who cares that's it's the middle of training camp. Shoot, why not have the whole team rent out the Delta Queen and engage in drunken debauchery for a 3 hour tour. Surely the organization wouldn't mind offering their support for their players to let off a little steam.

They've got to draw some lines. Eff up and there's a consequence. Already Odell is demoted to 3rd team for his suspension (not that he won't be starting again as soon as he's back). Henry was demoted but is clearly better than any of the other wides and no doubt be the 3rd wide even if that means he can't play until 2007.

Obviously Stein "Bock" didn't eff up with the style that Odell and Dopey did, but the position he put himself and the team in is one that shouldn't be condoned if the Bengals would like for the rest of their players to understand there's not a free pass back to the field while the status quo legal proceedings go on. Maybe if it were 1 or 2 players they could go on like other teams -- at least the ones that are more tolerant. But exceptional circumstances require exceptional measures. Too many of these players have spun out and if Marv wants to have any credibility among his players that character has some relevance, he'd better do something with Steinbach, like bench him before Palmer starts playing even if it's for 1 preseason game.

I would've much rather read that Steiny was spending his free time working out to improve his upper body strength so that he can better finish blocks like the one that didn't get finished when Kimo rolled Carson. But no, instead, we get to read that this dumba$$ is out getting plastered on the water. Enough is enough.

[bengalboomer7]

But the point here is that at some point I'd like to see the Bengals organization take an active position against these dumba$$es who get arrested for stupid crap. Rather than their passive, "We don't comment or take any action until the courts resolve these matters" BS, they really should take measures to deter players from idiocy --- most specifically during the middle of training camp. They need to start making examples of players that it is time for them to either fish or cut bait I'd like to see them demote Einsteiny for now to start turning their boat around on the issue of arrests and suspensions.

And under no circumstance would I potentially poison Eric Steinbach's contract negotiations by taking ANY proactive steps that would be very correctly be seen as little more than an empty gesture offered to appease a strangely wigged out fanbase. You don't demote one of the best young guards in the NFL for going too fast in a no wake zone or for having too many beers during his free time. What you do is say as little as possible about it while offering the player whatever support you can.

First off, there doesn't seem to be any contract negotiations to poison, at least if Einsteiny's bloodsucker is true to his word. But if there were, maybe the Steinster could have invited Marv, Katie and Paul Alexander out for a day on the water and they could've all got Schiltzfaced together. I mean, who cares that's it's the middle of training camp. Shoot, why not have the whole team rent out the Delta Queen and engage in drunken debauchery for a 3 hour tour. Surely the organization wouldn't mind offering their support for their players to let off a little steam.

They've got to draw some lines. Eff up and there's a consequence. Already Odell is demoted to 3rd team for his suspension (not that he won't be starting again as soon as he's back). Henry was demoted but is clearly better than any of the other wides and no doubt be the 3rd wide even if that means he can't play until 2007.

Obviously Stein "Bock" didn't eff up with the style that Odell and Dopey did, but the position he put himself and the team in is one that shouldn't be condoned if the Bengals would like for the rest of their players to understand there's not a free pass back to the field while the status quo legal proceedings go on. Maybe if it were 1 or 2 players they could go on like other teams -- at least the ones that are more tolerant. But exceptional circumstances require exceptional measures. Too many of these players have spun out and if Marv wants to have any credibility among his players that character has some relevance, he'd better do something with Steinbach, like bench him before Palmer starts playing even if it's for 1 preseason game.

I would've much rather read that Steiny was spending his free time working out to improve his upper body strength so that he can better finish blocks like the one that didn't get finished when Kimo rolled Carson. But no, instead, we get to read that this dumba$$ is out getting plastered on the water. Enough is enough.

The line should have been drawn already. How can you make an example out of Steiny, when you have several guys who did much worse practicing daily. Where was you help in the Henry thread?

[HairOnFire]

The line should have been drawn already. How can you make an example out of Steiny, when you have several guys who did much worse practicing daily. Where was you help in the Henry thread?

The Henry thread. The Rucker thread. The Odell thread. The Steinbach thread. It doesn't matter how many of these threads we have, you let the legal system handle the punishment for off-field misdeeds, and you let the coaching staff handle it when guys screw up as football players.

If Marvin handles this correctly...and he will...he'll do absolutely nothing to Steinbach.

[Dadraftnick]

Can this team go 2 weeks WITH OUT someone getting arrested ??

This is getting kind of old.

I dont care that it was driving a boat while drunk,these guys know that the whole country is waiting for the next guy on this team to screw up and they dont need to give them what they are looking for.

It makes it look like these guys are having it too easy at camp and they too much time on their hands.

Maybe Marvin needs to wear these guys out so, they are to tired to do anything else.

These guys have it made and they are getting paid a fortune to play a kids game and most of the men in America would pay a fortune to be in their shoes an they cant live by the rules that everyone else has to.

At some point the league needs to get with the NFLPA and raise the fines.

Lets get it straight this is not just a Bengal thing,a Steelers offensive lineman just got arrested too, this constant stream of arrests is a black eye to the league.

When one player after another,not just the Bengals,gets arested it looks bad on the guys everyone.

[Kirkendall]

They've got to draw some lines. Eff up and there's a consequence. Already Odell is demoted to 3rd team for his suspension (not that he won't be starting again as soon as he's back). Henry was demoted but is clearly better than any of the other wides and no doubt be the 3rd wide even if that means he can't play until 2007.

Schweiny, this is where you and I differ. I personally don't think Steinbach did anything more than most NFL players; was it wrong? I don't know if I can answer that because I drink and I have no write to condone someone for something I do myself (minus the boat). How many stories do we hear about players going out to clubs and getting dare thang on. I really don't think their pounding Gatorade and taking shots of apple juice.

I would've much rather read that Steiny was spending his free time working out to improve his upper body strength so that he can better finish blocks like the one that didn't get finished when Kimo rolled Carson.

As a football fan, I completely agree. But as a red blooded Uhmerikun, I say drink to your hearts content (just so some of you don't make some wild connection on my last statement, notice I didn't say anything about driving a boat; which is a very bad bad thing). When the season starts, our alternative pro-bowl guard will be knocking those f**king Steelers into the ground. That's all I ask for.

If they're going to punish Steinbach, then they'd better punish Justin Smith three times as hard.

Great job stirring debate. This is fun.

When one player after another,not just the Bengals,gets arested it looks bad on the guys everyone.

Dude, it's the way it is anymore. I personally think it'll get worse; must worse. But sports is usually a reflection of our own society. Maybe it's time for us to go NASCAR?? eh? WAKE UP Uhmerika! (Matt got me hooked on Earl Pitts quotes)