Fact or Fiction

[WHO DEY AGAIN?]

If the Bungles still had Corey Dillon and Jon Kitna starting--then there is no doubt that the Bungles would have a top 10 rated offense in the NFL.

Now that's the dumbest statement ever written on this site.

[Barbarian]

If the Bungles still had Corey Dillon and Jon Kitna starting--then there is no doubt that the Bungles would have a top 10 rated offense in the NFL.

Now that's the dumbest statement ever written on this site.

Tell me why--just don't make an absurd statement like this and not back it up. Give me facts. Try to prove your idiotic statement.

How do you post s**t like that without producing stats or facts???

[ckj414]

O-Line... Bobbie Williams and Rich Braham are both quality starters... better than Mike Goff and O'Dwyer and hey, guess what. We had an extremely good OL last year. Our depth isn't great, but it's not bad. Guys like Levya and Kooistra are solid back-ups. As for the point I made initially, when you have what could be 3 of the top 5 offensive linemen on 1 line, 2 of which are young and are expected to be better than they were last year. Our offensive line is very often talked about as one of the team's strong points by experts.

Now wait a second, you would call the offensive line that gave up the 14th most sacks last season 'extremely good'? I sure wouldn't. They were 14th in rush yards per carry, a bit better, but still just average. There were a few good individual performances last season, but the sum total offensive line play looks pretty average to me. Perhaps the new faces are upgrades, I hope they are. But Bobbie Williams is still an unknown quantity - 2003 was the first year in which he started, even then just as a back-up in the game due to injury. I don't know where you're getting the 'quality starter' tag from, wishful thinking perhaps?

Funny, that same offensive line I've more often seen cited as a weakness - specifically because of depth issues. I strongly believe that the OL will be the unit that most holds the Bengals back this season. Now if, IF the new guys prove to be upgrades, and the line can remain relatively injury free, they may be one of the better units around, but a few planets will need to align for that to happen.

[Barbarian]

O-Line... Bobbie Williams and Rich Braham are both quality starters... better than Mike Goff and O'Dwyer and hey, guess what. We had an extremely good OL last year. Our depth isn't great, but it's not bad. Guys like Levya and Kooistra are solid back-ups. As for the point I made initially, when you have what could be 3 of the top 5 offensive linemen on 1 line, 2 of which are young and are expected to be better than they were last year. Our offensive line is very often talked about as one of the team's strong points by experts.

Now wait a second, you would call the offensive line that gave up the 14th most sacks last season 'extremely good'? I sure wouldn't. They were 14th in rush yards per carry, a bit better, but still just average. There were a few good individual performances last season, but the sum total offensive line play looks pretty average to me. Perhaps the new faces are upgrades, I hope they are. But Bobbie Williams is still an unknown quantity - 2003 was the first year in which he started, even then just as a back-up in the game due to injury. I don't know where you're getting the 'quality starter' tag from, wishful thinking perhaps?

Funny, that same offensive line I've more often seen cited as a weakness - specifically because of depth issues. I strongly believe that the OL will be the unit that most holds the Bengals back this season. Now if, IF the new guys prove to be upgrades, and the line can remain relatively injury free, they may be one of the better units around, but a few planets will need to align for that to happen.

Well, if this holds to be true--then the Bungles are surely f**ked this year. I'm saying that the Defensive Line is the weak-link on this team. If both lines suck this year, you may see the Bungles slip back into the 2-14 team!!!

If you doubt me--ask yourself this:

At what location are football games won????? If you answered "in the trenches", then give yourself a pat on the back.

[skyline]

I strongly believe that the OL will be the unit that most holds the Bengals back this season. Now if, IF the new guys prove to be upgrades, and the line can remain relatively injury free, they may be one of the better units around, but a few planets will need to align for that to happen.

The O-line will hold us back? Did they hold us back last year?

Let me answer that one: no, they didn't. We had a very strong offense. While the O-line may not have been the best in the league, they were solid. Don't forget that a lot of those sacks given up were situations where Kitna should have gotten rid of the ball, but took the sack instead.

This year, it could be argued that they will be improved, but the jury is still out. We'll see if Steinbach having two healthy arms helps out, and whether Levi can fully recover from his injuries. Willie Anderson isn't slowing down yet. Hopefully Williams will help out. At the very least, you have to admit that they certainly haven't gotten any worse. That being the case, you think that now they're going to hold the team back this year? Seriously?

[schweinhart]

The O line is exceptional and we have backups with NFL starts.

Steinbach is great to watch for his speed and straight up strength. If Levi should go down at LT, ML no doubt shift will Steinbach there. No more Rehberg nightmare like the 2nd Ravens game to worry about.

[chrishcovga]

I'll answer the offensive line question.

- Yes Cincinnati has the makings of a great offensive line.

1. Levi Jones - not yet the dominant player, but ever so close. And was only credited with giving up 3 quarterback sacks last year playing next to a rookie guard. - 1 sack came the week after knee surgery against the 49ers.

2. Eric Steinbach - easily billed up to the hype of his 33rd overall selection and showed why he should have been a top first rounder. College shoulder and elbow injuries are behind him now, so his ability to hit moving targets in the running game should be even more explosive this year.

3. Rich Braham - one of the toughest and smartest lineman in the league. He is an iron-man at the center position. Perfect guy to have in place snapping the ball to a young quarterback.

4. Bobbie Williams - Large man with proven run blocking skills. More of an athlete than Mike Goff, so pass blocking techniques will be even better this year after stepping up last year for the Eagles injured probowler Jermaine Mayberry. Played on a line that averaged less than 2 sacks a game !

5. Willie Anderson - Long overdue pro bowl selection after being named an alternate twice before. - Dominant run blocking and finesse pass blocking make him one of the better right tackles in the game.

Depth -

1. Larry Moore C/G - Starter in both Indianapolis and Washington. Pro Bowl alternate. Peyton Mannings center for first 3 seasons. Athletic and plays with a mean streak. Highly underated, and could push Braham by mid-season or Bobbie Williams.

2. Scott Kooistra - T/c/G- Very athletic big man. Once thought to be Brahams' heir apparent to the starting center position, but has size to spell Big Willie at times last year.

3. Victor Leyva - G/T - Injuries have hampered his progress, but size and athletic ability can't be knocked. His preseason play has been lights out .

4. Stacy Andrews - 4th round selection. - True Athlete if there ever was one. 6-7 346 lbs. and runs a 4.96 in the '40. Only played 70 snaps of college football and yet was still considered the " sleeper " pick of the draft !

9 - players when most teams will probably keep 10 or 11. Cincinnati is in a good position to excell this year in O-line play. :player:

[schweinhart]

That answers that.

I thought Sulfsted might stick since he keeps getting cut and re-signed and has NFL starter experience. Might be some comp between Kooistra, Szalazay, and Sulfsted for #9 or #10.

Can't help but get the Pats in the Super Bowl out of my head...They only had 2 OL backups active. So, I'm thinking 10 since Andrews is so raw.

[redsfan2]

If the Bungles still had Corey Dillon and Jon Kitna starting--then there is no doubt that the Bungles would have a top 10 rated offense in the NFL.

Now that's the dumbest statement ever written on this site.

Tell me why--just don't make an absurd statement like this and not back it up. Give me facts. Try to prove your idiotic statement.

How do you post s**t like that without producing stats or facts???

Far be it from me to get in the middle of a private fight, but I have to admit that I'm not upset that we won't have Kitna or Dillon starting this year.

#1 Kitna has yet to have back to back good years. With us or Seattle. That's why his overall average is hovering around the 50's which is .... well .... average. While it's hard to know what to expect from Palmer, Kits record is a good indicator of what we could expect from him.

#2 Dillon was the most productive running back we've ever had on the team. Thing is tho that whether due to injury or attitude, he wasn't getting it done last year. It doesn't matter what he's capable of if he's not willing to do it, and from his comments on the way out the door ... he wasn't.

Just my 2 cents. You guys can continue now.

[ckj414]

The O-line will hold us back? Did they hold us back last year?

Let me answer that one: no, they didn't. We had a very strong offense. While the O-line may not have been the best in the league, they were solid. Don't forget that a lot of those sacks given up were situations where Kitna should have gotten rid of the ball, but took the sack instead.

This year, it could be argued that they will be improved, but the jury is still out. We'll see if Steinbach having two healthy arms helps out, and whether Levi can fully recover from his injuries. Willie Anderson isn't slowing down yet. Hopefully Williams will help out. At the very least, you have to admit that they certainly haven't gotten any worse. That being the case, you think that now they're going to hold the team back this year? Seriously?

To be honest, I think I've over-stated my opinion on this. When I say that the OL is going to hold the Bengals back, what I mean is that its the weakest unit of their offense. The makings of a great line may be there, I can't dispute that (although I'm not sold on Levi Jones yet), but in terms of present day production I think they'll be a let down to some folks.

An exceptional line?.. whoa, not even close. Just exceptional when compared to what we've seen from the Bengals the last several seasons.

[JPW]

Funny, that same offensive line I've more often seen cited as a weakness - specifically because of depth issues.

I do not remember reading of any "expert" who has called The Bengals OL a Weakness ?

I have seen a few that mentioned concerns over depth but they still had the OL rated rather highly.

An exceptional line?.. whoa, not even close. Just exceptional when compared to what we've seen from the Bengals the last several seasons.

I am not going to go back and find all the writers who have called The Bengals OL a Strength.

But you might want to take a look at this: Rankings — Team Offensive Line

Being ranked 6th Best out of 32 Teams is not bad at all.