Pat Sims and Jason Shirley or Shaun Rodgers???

[Clackwoods]

Looking back at the trade that almost happened last off season where we traded a third and fifth for Rodgers I am beginning to wonder if we actually lucked out by not getting him. We didn't have to give him a big contract extension and we ended up getting a younger talented DT in the process and then another guy to fill out the rotation for the future. Also, should we have traded a pick or two that we didn't use on Rodgers to go up and get Ellis? In hindsight I love Rivers and I am very happy with the way it turned out. What are your thoughts?

http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summa...86-34081569_ITM

[agreen_112]

We need to win NOW! At the same time I don't know how much Shaun would've helped the '08 Bengals. Carson's getting older and older..

[Clackwoods]

We need to win NOW! At the same time I don't know how much Shaun would've helped the '08 Bengals. Carson's getting older and older..

I do agree that we need to win now. I do not understand one thing though, once the season was lost why didn't we trade TJ for a pick in the draft? I am sure we could have gotten a second rounder for him at the very least.

[Chucktkd]

I guess Peko will be riding the pine in the future....

[Ickey44]

We need to win NOW! At the same time I don't know how much Shaun would've helped the '08 Bengals. Carson's getting older and older..

I do agree that we need to win now. I do not understand one thing though, once the season was lost why didn't we trade TJ for a pick in the draft? I am sure we could have gotten a second rounder for him at the very least.

Because the trade deadline is Week 6?

[icehole3]

We need to win NOW! At the same time I don't know how much Shaun would've helped the '08 Bengals. Carson's getting older and older..

I do agree that we need to win now. I do not understand one thing though, once the season was lost why didn't we trade TJ for a pick in the draft? I am sure we could have gotten a second rounder for him at the very least.

Because the trade deadline is Week 6?

thats something I think the NFL should change, move that deadline to week 10 and watch all the player movement

[Ickey44]

We need to win NOW! At the same time I don't know how much Shaun would've helped the '08 Bengals. Carson's getting older and older..

I do agree that we need to win now. I do not understand one thing though, once the season was lost why didn't we trade TJ for a pick in the draft? I am sure we could have gotten a second rounder for him at the very least.

Because the trade deadline is Week 6?

thats something I think the NFL should change, move that deadline to week 10 and watch all the player movement

I agree.

[Bearcat1975]

We need to win NOW! At the same time I don't know how much Shaun would've helped the '08 Bengals. Carson's getting older and older..

I do agree that we need to win now. I do not understand one thing though, once the season was lost why didn't we trade TJ for a pick in the draft? I am sure we could have gotten a second rounder for him at the very least.

Because the trade deadline is Week 6?

thats something I think the NFL should change, move that deadline to week 10 and watch all the player movement

Why?

In this age of free agency its already pretty much down to just rooting for the uniform. Players come and go at a fast enough rate already. Under your scenario, the turnover rate would be at least as bad as MLB and probably worse.

Perennial losers who play the small market card like the Bengals would trade all of their talent away for 2nd day draft picks and players to be named later, every season at week 10.

Moving the trade deadline to week 10 would have a similar effect to the Bengals that an uncapped NFL would. Any remote possibilities that the Bengals could somehow stumble into the playoffs would be long gone. The Bengals would be like the NFL minor leagues. "Develop" here until week 10, then off to a real team.

No thanks. This team handicaps itself enough without more help from the league.

[HAPPYJAQ]

The wildcard is Shirley. Marvin said earlier in the off-season that the team "might have hit a homerun" in drafting him, but he looks to be as much as a developmental player as Stacey Andrews was. In the few games that he played last season, his quickness is evident and incredible for his size. I'm not sold on Pat Sims and the signing of Tank says something about what they think about Pat's ability to get after the passer...at least next season.

Make no mistake about it, Shaun Rogers is still an elite DT in the NFL and went to the Pro Bowl last season. It would've been nice to see what he could do playing between Peko and Geathers on the defensive line, but let's all hope that Shirley can be eventually be the same kind of huge, dominant DT that we've craved for years.

[sparky151]

I said at the time the Rogers trade was revoked, that Rogers had more probowls in his future than anyone we would draft. I was hoping for Ellis last year. He had a pretty good year for New Orleans, arguably better than Sims. On the whole, I'd prefer the combo of Ellis and Brandon Johnson to Sims and Rivers.

[Kazkal]

I'm not sold on Pat Sims and the signing of Tank says something about what they think about Pat's ability to get after the passer...at least next season.

Tank Johnson signing has something to do with Pat Sims? LOL.....If they weren't confident in sims they would draft BJ Raji since he would fill the same roll Sims does as a space eater...Not only that we only had 3 Very Large DT's which we needed a 4th so a smaller penetration DT makes more sense.

[JoePong]

Yeah I think I would probably rather have Jason Shirdley and Pat Simds over Shaun Rodgers. I think I would take Rodgers over Sedrick Elldis though...

What do you think of Carson Palmder over Jay Cutlder?

[Clackwoods]

Yeah I think I would probably rather have Jason Shirdley and Pat Simds over Shaun Rodgers. I think I would take Rodgers over Sedrick Elldis though...

What do you think of Carson Palmder over Jay Cutlder?

I would much rather have a healthy Carson over a healthy Jay Cutler, but......

Taking into account his age and his injury history and also Cutlers ability to scramble I would much rather have Jay Cutler as my franchise QB. I know that is kind of blasphemy, but the guy has skills.

[HAPPYJAQ]

I'm not sold on Pat Sims and the signing of Tank says something about what they think about Pat's ability to get after the passer...at least next season.

Tank Johnson signing has something to do with Pat Sims? LOL.....If they weren't confident in sims they would draft BJ Raji since he would fill the same roll Sims does as a space eater...Not only that we only had 3 Very Large DT's which we needed a 4th so a smaller penetration DT makes more sense.

Two different positions, my friend.

Peko and Shirley are our "four" position DTs. while Sims, Tank and Orien Harris are straight "three" guys. Raji is also seen as a "four" who could possibly play the "three" and I think that Peko could swing there, too. The way it is now, Tank will replace Sims on passing downs which says that maybe the Bengals don't feel like Sims can consistently get pressure on the QB, at this stage of his development.

I think the Bengals are putting a lot of emphasis on getting more production out of their pass rush and they might've decided against Raji in that consideration, as he's mainly a run stopper regardless of his presumed versatility at DT.

[derekshank]

I'm not sold on Pat Sims and the signing of Tank says something about what they think about Pat's ability to get after the passer...at least next season.

Tank Johnson signing has something to do with Pat Sims? LOL.....If they weren't confident in sims they would draft BJ Raji since he would fill the same roll Sims does as a space eater...Not only that we only had 3 Very Large DT's which we needed a 4th so a smaller penetration DT makes more sense.

Two different positions, my friend.

Peko and Shirley are our "four" position DTs. while Sims, Tank and Orien Harris are straight "three" guys. Raji is also seen as a "four" who could possibly play the "three" and I think that Peko could swing there, too. The way it is now, Tank will replace Sims on passing downs which says that maybe the Bengals don't feel like Sims can consistently get pressure on the QB, at this stage of his development.

I think the Bengals are putting a lot of emphasis on getting more production out of their pass rush and they might've decided against Raji in that consideration, as he's mainly a run stopper regardless of his presumed versatility at DT.

Frankly, Sims penetration into the backfield at the end of last season made Peko look like the guy that should come out on passing downs.

Of course, there is always the possibility of the sophomore slump in that trait.

[JoePong]

Yeah I don't know what that guy is talking about but Peko is more of a space eater role than Sims. Sims is the guy who gets into the backfield and make plays and is more disruptive and a penetrator. The fact that Sims is bigger than Peko doesn't have much to do with it. Peko is just a solid guy who doesn't make many plays. Probably more suited to be a 3rd DT in a rotation.

[HAPPYJAQ]

Yeah I don't know what that guy is talking about but Peko is more of a space eater role than Sims. Sims is the guy who gets into the backfield and make plays and is more disruptive and a penetrator. The fact that Sims is bigger than Peko doesn't have much to do with it. Peko is just a solid guy who doesn't make many plays. Probably more suited to be a 3rd DT in a rotation.

It's because they play TWO DIFFERENT POSITIONS. Peko is the equivalent to a NT in the Bengals 4-3 (think Pat Williams in Minnesota). What that means is that he is almost always blocked by both a Center and a Guard. Sims and now Tank play the underneath DT, or the "3" technique. They only have the responsibility of beating the LG on most plays.

As far as Peko goes, he is much more than solid. Part of the reason that the Bengals rush defense improved so dramatically is the presence of Peko in the middle. Out of the entire league, only Shaun Rogers had more tackles than Peko last season amongst interior defensive linemen. There's a reason the Bengals gave him 30 million dollars and he is a rapidly improving player who's still only 24 years old.

[derekshank]

Yeah I don't know what that guy is talking about but Peko is more of a space eater role than Sims. Sims is the guy who gets into the backfield and make plays and is more disruptive and a penetrator. The fact that Sims is bigger than Peko doesn't have much to do with it. Peko is just a solid guy who doesn't make many plays. Probably more suited to be a 3rd DT in a rotation.

It's because they play TWO DIFFERENT POSITIONS. Peko is the equivalent to a NT in the Bengals 4-3 (think Pat Williams in Minnesota). What that means is that he is almost always blocked by both a Center and a Guard. Sims and now Tank play the underneath DT, or the "3" technique. They only have the responsibility of beating the LG on most plays.

As far as Peko goes, he is much more than solid. Part of the reason that the Bengals rush defense improved so dramatically is the presence of Peko in the middle. Out of the entire league, only Shaun Rogers had more tackles than Peko last season amongst interior defensive linemen. There's a reason the Bengals gave him 30 million dollars and he is a rapidly improving player who's still only 24 years old.

For the record, I was never attempting to say that Sims is better than Peko. I love the play the Bengals get from Peko. But as far as penetration into the backfield, Sims was very impressive late in the season last year.

[redsbengalsbucks]

The good thing is that with Peko, Sims, Tank and maybe even Shirley rotating in at DT they will stay fresher all year long and this is the best depth at the position in years.

[derekshank]

The good thing is that with Peko, Sims, Tank and maybe even Shirley rotating in at DT they will stay fresher all year long and this is the best depth at the position in years.

I hope so. I'm not so sure you can throw Shirley in that rotation just yet. He's had flashes, but nothing to suggest he's ready to be what we hope he may someday become. And frankly, despite the fact that I like Sims a lot, he's still only in his second year - and didn't play a full season last year. He should still be seen as something of a question mark.

I think the DT position has the best potential is has had in years, because the Bengals have moved on from the philosophy of old washed up journeymen stop gaps. But I don't know how truly deep they are on the depth chart, simply because Peko is the only guy I feel like I know what you're going to get.

[ArmyBengal]

I was one that always liked the drafting of Shirley. I'm not sure what bringing Tank in does to his development, but I really hope he has put things behind him and is making strides to be the player I think he can be.