Must learn from 2004 Draft!

[walzav29]

I seen that the Bengals have 11 picks. In 2004 they had 10, and currently 1 guy is a starter (Geathers) and only 2 are still on the team. Perry is on his way out. That is a PATHETIC display of drafting. HORRIBLE.

http://football.about.com/cs/nfldrafthisto...aftteampics.htm

All we can do is Pray that their scouting technique has changed in the last 5 years. Let's hope!

[Clackwoods]

I seen that the Bengals have 11 picks. In 1994 they had 10, and currently 1 guy is a starter (Geathers) and only 2 are still on the team. Perry is on his way out. That is a PATHETIC display of drafting. HORRIBLE.

http://football.about.com/cs/nfldrafthisto...aftteampics.htm

All we can do is Pray that their scouting technique has changed in the last 5 years. Let's hope!

Damn is Geathers that old? lmao jk.

You mean 2004 obviously and I agree with you. The difference is that we actually have a much higher pick this year which will be harder to jack up and Marvin seems to be past taking bad character guys earlier than round 4.

[walzav29]

Ooops. 2004. Tell me that this draft was bad for the Cardinals. I guess the main thing is value not position. We would balk at the Bengals if they picked Crabtree.

Arizona

1 (3) - Larry Fitzgerald, WR Pittsburgh

2 (33) - Karlos Dansby, OLB Auburn

3 (64) - Darnell Dockett, DT Florida State

4 (100) - Alex Stepanovich, C Ohio State

5 (135) - Antonio Smith, DE Oklahoma State

6 (167) - Nick Leckey, C Kansas State

7 (202) - John Navarre, QB Michigan

[Clackwoods]

Ooops. 2004. Tell me that this draft was bad for the Cardinals. I guess the main thing is value not position. We would balk at the Bengals if they picked Crabtree.

Arizona

1 (3) - Larry Fitzgerald, WR Pittsburgh

2 (33) - Karlos Dansby, OLB Auburn

3 (64) - Darnell Dockett, DT Florida State

4 (100) - Alex Stepanovich, C Ohio State

5 (135) - Antonio Smith, DE Oklahoma State

6 (167) - Nick Leckey, C Kansas State

7 (202) - John Navarre, QB Michigan

Personally,

I would be happy as hell if we took Crabtree, the dude is a savage. I would much rather have Crabtree and Rey Rey (Picked with the pick we would get with Chad, even if we had to throw in a third to get up high enough) than Chad and Bj Raji!

[derekshank]

Personally,

I would be happy as hell if we took Crabtree, the dude is a savage. I would much rather have Crabtree and Rey Rey (Picked with the pick we would get with Chad, even if we had to throw in a third to get up high enough) than Chad and Bj Raji!

I agree if those are the only two options. But I would rather trade Chad and not draft a WR in the 1st. Take Andre Smith, and Maualuga. That's my dream that won't come true.

[Clackwoods]

Personally,

I would be happy as hell if we took Crabtree, the dude is a savage. I would much rather have Crabtree and Rey Rey (Picked with the pick we would get with Chad, even if we had to throw in a third to get up high enough) than Chad and Bj Raji!

I agree if those are the only two options. But I would rather trade Chad and not draft a WR in the 1st. Take Andre Smith, and Maualuga. That's my dream that won't come true.

JUST SAY NO TO ANDRE. Sorry, I don't want a fat, idiot at number six. We already have a RT in Collins and he is cheap, why would we take Andre. I would really like to see us trade Chad and get Rey and I think that would be ideal, but if we take an OT at six it will be Monroe. Otherwise I think we will just get our center in Round 2 and then get an OT in round 3 for depth behind Whit and Collins. Probably someone that can play OT and OG.

[derekshank]

Personally,

I would be happy as hell if we took Crabtree, the dude is a savage. I would much rather have Crabtree and Rey Rey (Picked with the pick we would get with Chad, even if we had to throw in a third to get up high enough) than Chad and Bj Raji!

I agree if those are the only two options. But I would rather trade Chad and not draft a WR in the 1st. Take Andre Smith, and Maualuga. That's my dream that won't come true.

JUST SAY NO TO ANDRE. Sorry, I don't want a fat, idiot at number six. We already have a RT in Collins and he is cheap, why would we take Andre. I would really like to see us trade Chad and get Rey and I think that would be ideal, but if we take an OT at six it will be Monroe. Otherwise I think we will just get our center in Round 2 and then get an OT in round 3 for depth behind Whit and Collins. Probably someone that can play OT and OG.

I just don't get why everyone is sold on Whit and Collins as starting OT's. Collins didn't show me anything last year except that he can't stop speed rushers. Whitworth was moved to guard for a reason. He's a solid backup at LT... but not starter quality. Andre Smith would be better than both of them.

Everyone loved Willie while he was here, but he was never the picture of health. He had a big gut and looked out of shape his entire career... but he knew how to play football. Smith is the same.

The Bengals need better OT's. If they don't get them, we'll have another season with everyone bitching about how terrible the offense is. Everyone will complain that the Bengals didn't address the O-line early and often in the draft, and everyone will quickly forget how they fell in love with skill positions prior to the draft.

[Clackwoods]

Personally,

I would be happy as hell if we took Crabtree, the dude is a savage. I would much rather have Crabtree and Rey Rey (Picked with the pick we would get with Chad, even if we had to throw in a third to get up high enough) than Chad and Bj Raji!

I agree if those are the only two options. But I would rather trade Chad and not draft a WR in the 1st. Take Andre Smith, and Maualuga. That's my dream that won't come true.

JUST SAY NO TO ANDRE. Sorry, I don't want a fat, idiot at number six. We already have a RT in Collins and he is cheap, why would we take Andre. I would really like to see us trade Chad and get Rey and I think that would be ideal, but if we take an OT at six it will be Monroe. Otherwise I think we will just get our center in Round 2 and then get an OT in round 3 for depth behind Whit and Collins. Probably someone that can play OT and OG.

I just don't get why everyone is sold on Whit and Collins as starting OT's. Collins didn't show me anything last year except that he can't stop speed rushers. Whitworth was moved to guard for a reason. He's a solid backup at LT... but not starter quality. Andre Smith would be better than both of them.

Everyone loved Willie while he was here, but he was never the picture of health. He had a big gut and looked out of shape his entire career... but he knew how to play football. Smith is the same.

The Bengals need better OT's. If they don't get them, we'll have another season with everyone bitching about how terrible the offense is. Everyone will complain that the Bengals didn't address the O-line early and often in the draft, and everyone will quickly forget how they fell in love with skill positions prior to the draft.

Your right, he was moved to Guard for a reason. Because we had a HOF tackle on the right side and a Franchise dominant LT. He was picked in the event that we lost Steinbach, but that doesn't mean he can't play it. Trust me I am not denying the dudes talent and if you do look at how Alabama did in the bowl game without him. All I am saying is I don't want some idiot that is going to come in and fizzle out for whatever reason. Do we really want to take a chance on someone with numerous character issues? If we really want a LT we can trade back into the first and take Britton from AZ!

[derekshank]

Your right, he was moved to Guard for a reason. Because we had a HOF tackle on the right side and a Franchise dominant LT. He was picked in the event that we lost Steinbach, but that doesn't mean he can't play it. Trust me I am not denying the dudes talent and if you do look at how Alabama did in the bowl game without him. All I am saying is I don't want some idiot that is going to come in and fizzle out for whatever reason. Do we really want to take a chance on someone with numerous character issues? If we really want a LT we can trade back into the first and take Britton from AZ!

Look... Whitworth was a very good college LT. But he was always projected to be a a guard. Best case scenario for him was to end up as a RT. The reason? He doesn't have the lateral quickness to handle the edge rush. Same problem with Collins.

I could live with one of them at the tackle position. Move either one of them to the RT and have a TE over there to help with quicker DE's and LB's. But to have both OT's have problems in pass protection is just begging for trouble.

I understand the concern with Andre Smith. I really do. But in my opinion he is worth the risk. During the season he was the undisputed #1 pick in the draft. This is based on his on the field play. Much of the criticism against Smith is unfounded in my opinion. He showed some immaturity when he focused on finding an agent rather than being ready for the combine - but really that's it. We're not talking about Pacman Jones here.

Everything else is a complaint against his body type. He would be a phenomenal value pick because he performs at a #1 overall pick level, but can be had significantly later.

[Baraka]

derek, i'm coming around to your side of things regarding andre smith. during the season he was considered the best talent coming out based on three years of domination, and somehow in two and half months since the season has ended, his skills have drastically diminished?

he'll have the same problems on the left side as whitworth and probably makes a better right tackle as well. paying a right tackle top ten money seems a bit ridiculous.

all in all, this kids character has never really been an issue for me, he's a church going, soft spoken guy. saban even said if he had come back they would welcome him with open arms, despite the suspension.

[ArmyBengal]

It has been said time and time again, you can't base what these guys do in one game or during the combine and make the ABSOLUTE decision on them. It's just plain stupid to completely cast aside the dominance of their play for however many seasons because of a mistake made at the combine. I compare this to Alex Mack who has been the dominant Center for the majority of the offseason until recently. I still view him as the top Center and if the one mock draft that was posted about us getting BOTH Smith and Mack were to happen, I would be doing back flips.

I just don't see them blowing the draft the way they did in 2004. I am still hoping to see movement down early and then up later since we got those 4 picks to help the thought of giving up picks to move up.

[walzav29]

Do the Bengals still have the same number of scouts as they did in 04?

[Clackwoods]

It has been said time and time again, you can't base what these guys do in one game or during the combine and make the ABSOLUTE decision on them. It's just plain stupid to completely cast aside the dominance of their play for however many seasons because of a mistake made at the combine. I compare this to Alex Mack who has been the dominant Center for the majority of the offseason until recently. I still view him as the top Center and if the one mock draft that was posted about us getting BOTH Smith and Mack were to happen, I would be doing back flips.

I just don't see them blowing the draft the way they did in 2004. I am still hoping to see movement down early and then up later since we got those 4 picks to help the thought of giving up picks to move up.

Look, if the guy translates the skills he showed in college to the NFL with no character issues then that is great. I just don't want to sit here in three years and criticize this pick, especially when everyone is bitching how we shouldn't have drafted him that high anyways because of his character concerns. I just think this team is way to close to being a Superbowl contending team to take a chance. If we wanted we could trade down a little and get Rey Rey around 10-13 and then trade Chad and pick up either Britton or Oher. Then in the second we take the best Center available. I am more about being safe and taking the sure thing as opposed to drafting someone with a hugeeee question mark at six.

Also, I would say I want him back if I was Saban to. Did you see how they got stuffed in the game he didn't play in? Sabin would only have to put up with his s**t for one year and then he could ship him out the door!

[Kazkal]

I just don't get why everyone is sold on Whit and Collins as starting OT's. Collins didn't show me anything last year except that he can't stop speed rushers. Whitworth was moved to guard for a reason. He's a solid backup at LT... but not starter quality. Andre Smith would be better than both of them.

I could have swore whitworth was Moved to guard because at the time Levi & Willie were our starting tackles and Whitworth was a better guard then stacey.

[derekshank]

I just don't get why everyone is sold on Whit and Collins as starting OT's. Collins didn't show me anything last year except that he can't stop speed rushers. Whitworth was moved to guard for a reason. He's a solid backup at LT... but not starter quality. Andre Smith would be better than both of them.

I could have swore whitworth was Moved to guard because at the time Levi & Willie were our starting tackles and Whitworth was a better guard then stacey.

Fair enough. But that doesn't change the fact that no one viewed him as a LT coming out of college. If you would rather have him play RT and move Collins to LG, fine. But in my opinion, the LT for the Bengals should not be someone they have on the roster right now.

[UF_Gators_15]

I would like to move Collins to RT and keep Whitworth at LG and draft Eugene Monroe, can u imagine how dominate our left side would be?

1. Lions- Jason Smith

2. Rams- Eugene Monroe

3. Chiefs- Aaron Curry

4. Seahawks- ????- Matt Stafford

5. Browns- Michael Crabtree

6. Bengals- Brian Orakpo

Since I don't think Eugene will drop to us, a man can dream tho. I have no idea where the Seahawks will go, I think the Browns will take Crabtree if available b/c they are shopping Braylon, and with Winslow in Tampa now, the Browns offense does not scare me at all and won't move the ball on anyone. If the first 5 picks go like this then I want Orakpo as I demostrated up top, even with 2 ends making boo coo money on our team already, Orakpo is a beast and we need to get to the QB better, a hell of a lot better than we do now!

[Clackwoods]

I would like to move Collins to RT and keep Whitworth at LG and draft Eugene Monroe, can u imagine how dominate our left side would be?

1. Lions- Jason Smith

2. Rams- Eugene Monroe

3. Chiefs- Aaron Curry

4. Seahawks- ????- Matt Stafford

5. Browns- Michael Crabtree

6. Bengals- Brian Orakpo

Since I don't think Eugene will drop to us, a man can dream tho. I have no idea where the Seahawks will go, I think the Browns will take Crabtree if available b/c they are shopping Braylon, and with Winslow in Tampa now, the Browns offense does not scare me at all and won't move the ball on anyone. If the first 5 picks go like this then I want Orakpo as I demostrated up top, even with 2 ends making boo coo money on our team already, Orakpo is a beast and we need to get to the QB better, a hell of a lot better than we do now!

I would really really like Orakpo. I have been on that train for a long time. I want Orakpo or Crabtree if a top 2 OT isn't their. If we trade down I want Moreno or Rey Rey!

[whizzo]

1) lions - stafford

2) rams - j. smith or monroe

3) chiefs - curry

4) seahawks - monroe or j. smith

5) browns - orakpo, crabtree or jenkins

6) bengals - a. smith or orakpo

i'd be happy with either of those.

[Clackwoods]

1) lions - stafford

2) rams - j. smith or monroe

3) chiefs - curry

4) seahawks - monroe or j. smith

5) browns - orakpo, crabtree or jenkins

6) bengals - a. smith or orakpo

i'd be happy with either of those.

F*** ANDRE SMITH!

[PhunkE1]

Look, if the guy translates the skills he showed in college to the NFL with no character issues then that is great. I just don't want to sit here in three years and criticize this pick, especially when everyone is bitching how we shouldn't have drafted him that high anyways because of his character concerns. I just think this team is way to close to being a Superbowl contending team to take a chance. If we wanted we could trade down a little and get Rey Rey around 10-13 and then trade Chad and pick up either Britton or Oher. Then in the second we take the best Center available. I am more about being safe and taking the sure thing as opposed to drafting someone with a hugeeee question mark at six.

Also, I would say I want him back if I was Saban to. Did you see how they got stuffed in the game he didn't play in? Sabin would only have to put up with his s**t for one year and then he could ship him out the door!

I think ASmith's so called "Charecter Issues" are being blown way out of proportion. The only incident that I'm aware of is his questionable judgement on hiring an agent. I saw some footage from Alabama's pro day and couldn't help but be impressed with how this young man carries himself. The guy has freakish ability, that's never been questioned. He will not make it out of the top 10 picks, IMHO. I would be perfectly happy with him at #6.

[HAPPYJAQ]

Smith is too much of a "boom or bust", for my taste. Number 6 overall is too high to draft a player of Smith's caliber. People around here are still pissed that we swung and missed on Perry, Thurman and Henry (amongst others). None of those guys were even top 20 picks! Those same people were less than enamored with Justin Smith's play as the #4 pick overall while he was here and he was (and still is) a pretty good player, not to mention statistically one of the best Bengals DE's ever

I just hope everybody who thinks that Andre Smith is worth the #6 pick are planning on not being critical of his play if he only ends up being a decent RG for the Bengals.

[ArmyBengal]

I still am of the midset that if they are really thinking they are only getting a RT, then WAIT until later on and get a true RT.

[UF_Gators_15]

Smith is too much of a "boom or bust", for my taste. Number 6 overall is too high to draft a player of Smith's caliber. People around here are still pissed that we swung and missed on Perry, Thurman and Henry (amongst others). None of those guys were even top 20 picks! Those same people were less than enamored with Justin Smith's play as the #4 pick overall while he was here and he was (and still is) a pretty good player, not to mention statistically one of the best Bengals DE's ever

I just hope everybody who thinks that Andre Smith is worth the #6 pick are planning on not being critical of his play if he only ends up being a decent RG for the Bengals.

I agree, I don't want to take a chance on him just b/c he plays a position of need. Granted, I get the arguement that b4 Bama's bowl game he was considered a Top2 pick, but the problems is that he knew how important this evalutation is and the fact that he put himself above his team to hire an agent and get suspended and then his team gets demolished by Utah, then he goes AWOL at the Combine by showing up outta shape b/c he spent too long looking for an agent, then making excuses about the combine he still shows up outta shape at his Pro Day by putting up a weak 17 reps on the bench press. This kid is all about the money, and everyone wants to get paid but most players actually work hard for it! He will get his signing bonus and be fine with it!

I say we take best player available regardless of position. I don't care if we already have 2 ends, if Orakpo is there, take him. I don't care if we have Ocho, Coles and drafted to future starters at WR, take Crabtree if the 2 tackles are gone.

Can we all agree that unless someone suprises on draft day the Top 5 in whatever order will be: Jason Smith, Eugene Monroe, Aaron Curry, Matt Stafford, and Brian Orakpo?

We can only hope that someone takes Stafford b/c that will push someone to us b/c that is the one position that we don't take!

Sorry for rambling, I love draft talk!

[HAPPYJAQ]

Smith is too much of a "boom or bust", for my taste. Number 6 overall is too high to draft a player of Smith's caliber. People around here are still pissed that we swung and missed on Perry, Thurman and Henry (amongst others). None of those guys were even top 20 picks! Those same people were less than enamored with Justin Smith's play as the #4 pick overall while he was here and he was (and still is) a pretty good player, not to mention statistically one of the best Bengals DE's ever

I just hope everybody who thinks that Andre Smith is worth the #6 pick are planning on not being critical of his play if he only ends up being a decent RG for the Bengals.

I agree, I don't want to take a chance on him just b/c he plays a position of need. Granted, I get the arguement that b4 Bama's bowl game he was considered a Top2 pick, but the problems is that he knew how important this evalutation is and the fact that he put himself above his team to hire an agent and get suspended and then his team gets demolished by Utah, then he goes AWOL at the Combine by showing up outta shape b/c he spent too long looking for an agent, then making excuses about the combine he still shows up outta shape at his Pro Day by putting up a weak 17 reps on the bench press. This kid is all about the money, and everyone wants to get paid but most players actually work hard for it! He will get his signing bonus and be fine with it!

I say we take best player available regardless of position. I don't care if we already have 2 ends, if Orakpo is there, take him. I don't care if we have Ocho, Coles and drafted to future starters at WR, take Crabtree if the 2 tackles are gone.

Can we all agree that unless someone suprises on draft day the Top 5 in whatever order will be: Jason Smith, Eugene Monroe, Aaron Curry, Matt Stafford, and Brian Orakpo?

We can only hope that someone takes Stafford b/c that will push someone to us b/c that is the one position that we don't take!

Sorry for rambling, I love draft talk!

Pretty dead on, there...and I love draft talk, too.

I don't think Stafford goes lower than 4, which would mean one of the linemen between Jason Smith or Monroe slide to the Bengals. I'd be happy with either guy but I'd be curious to know how much Oakland (or some other team)would offer to come up and select the best OL, WR or 2nd best QB. This is a extremely deep draft and imagine what the Bengals could do with a high to mid 1st, high 2nd and three 3rds, potentially.

[walzav29]

Those stupid Lions might take a tackle and the other one will be gone. (Smith and Monroe) If that happens, then it's decision time. It's gonna be nerve wrecking.