Rush to Rush

[HairOnFire]

IF they go defense at pick 6 and do not trade the pick, the ONLY player Marvin & Zimmer would be intersted in would be BJ Raji. He's probably the 2nd most NFL ready defensive player in the draft (Curry), and would set up a great rotation woth Peko & Sims.

Ridiculous. How many times do Marvin and Zimmer have to talk about the incredible need for additional pass rushers before you guys get it?

Point blank, any argument you can make in favor of adding Raji to the interior rotation is even truer when talking about pass rush heat from the edge.

[HAPPYJAQ]

IF they go defense at pick 6 and do not trade the pick, the ONLY player Marvin & Zimmer would be intersted in would be BJ Raji. He's probably the 2nd most NFL ready defensive player in the draft (Curry), and would set up a great rotation woth Peko & Sims.

Ridiculous. How many times do Marvin and Zimmer have to talk about the incredible need for additional pass rushers before you guys get it?

Point blank, any argument you can make in favor of adding Raji to the interior rotation is even truer when talking about pass rush heat from the edge.

Do you believe it's possible to improve the pash rush ability by upgrading the DT position?

I'll toss this fact in for fun, in 2006 Sam Adams started every game for the Bengals and Robert Geathers contributed 10.5 of the team's 35 sacks (Justin Smith also had 7.5 sacks). Last season, with no interior player consistently commanding double-teams from the opposition, the Bengals had less than half of the '06 total.

I understand that score, possessions, field position, etc. are factors, too...but I believe that the pash rush starts from the inside out, unless you have a truly gifted pash rusher (or two) at the DE positions. Look at the deal Haynesworth got. I don't think that Raji is a Haynesworth type of player but I think he would instantly become the best defensive lineman on the team, if drafted, and he is virtually unblockable one-on-one.

[HairOnFire]

Do you believe it's possible to improve the pash rush ability by upgrading the DT position?

Absolutely. In fact, I made many of the same arguments you're making now as recently as last year...before Sims and Shirley were added. So there's nothing wrong with the rant. I'm just not feeling it as much right now.

[Kazkal]

I'll toss this fact in for fun, in 2006 Sam Adams started every game for the Bengals and Robert Geathers contributed 10.5 of the team's 35 sacks (Justin Smith also had 7.5 sacks). Last season, with no interior player consistently commanding double-teams from the opposition, the Bengals had less than half of the '06 total.

-Geathers only weighed about 260ish lbs and was a situational passrusher,Robinson was DE on running downs..

-Justin Smith was a 6-8 end sack type of end If the DT play was helping I'd expect 9-12 sacks..

-I do think Upgrading DT would help but I think upgrading Defensive end or even passrushing SLB would help more.,

[HairOnFire]

-I do think Upgrading DT would help but I think upgrading Defensive end or even passrushing SLB would help more.,

There it is.

[ArmyBengal]

Praying that Shirley can figure things out: 6'5, 338 is the wide body we have been begging for. If they think for a minute that Shirley has put his legal issues behind him and can focus on improving his game, Raji is less of a thought than he probably already is at #6.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Do you believe it's possible to improve the pash rush ability by upgrading the DT position?

Absolutely. In fact, I made many of the same arguments you're making now as recently as last year...before Sims and Shirley were added. So there's nothing wrong with the rant. I'm just not feeling it as much right now.

You don't think a stud DT would make people forget about those guys? Not that I'm necessarily enamored with a plugger picked in the first 10 given their flame-out rate, but still.

I don't know where to get him, but I still want to see a DT that goes about 345 and eats RB like Fat Bastard eats babies. Maybe one of Shirley and Sims can turn into that guy, but seeing Raji at #6 wouldn't make me curse Mike Brown's family tree or anything.

[HAPPYJAQ]

I'm warming to this concept, but it would take the right type of player to execute what some are proposing in adding an OLB/DE type to the equation. The one thing that takes me out of being 100% convinced that Raji would be the best solution, is the fact that he hasn't shown any real knack of getting to the QB at the collegiate level.

That said, consider the roster. Rivers is your WLB for the next 8-10 seasons, no question. He is also a Nickel LB, along with Johnson, so he's a 3 down player. Dhani is performing well, if not spectacular inside and is the leader of the defense, in terms of getting guys lined up correctly and such. Rashad Jeanty is the best run stopping LB on the team, by far. That takes any added player who can play LB out of the conversation on 1st and 2nd-and-normal situations.

As far as the DE position, Geathers and Odom are both better run-stoppers than pash-rushers, IMO. Between the two, Odom has shown the best consistency in converting the pash rush opportunities, so he's a 3-down player. You also have to figure than Rucker will be playing a lot on rushing downs, considering his performance from last season. The other problem is, if you determine than Geathers should be replaced on passing downs (ironic as the player on the team who's had the most recent double-digit sack season), you have a DE/OLB type that might play situationally on 3rd downs only, and when do you play Geathers, as one of your highest paid players on defense (pay is always a factor)? One solution that I thought of would be to move Geathers back inside, but he struggled horribly at that when they had him there.

Do you all think that's rich for the #6 overall pick in the draft?

For that reasoning, the only OLB/DE type the Bengals might consider at that spot would be Brian Orakpo, but even then they'd have to be convinced that he could eventually be a 3-down player by 2010 at SLB, replacing Rashad Jeanty with equal run-stopping ability. You cannot select a 2-down (or less) defensive player as a Top 10 pick.

[HairOnFire]

For that reasoning, the only OLB/DE type the Bengals might consider at that spot would be Brian Orakpo, but even then they'd have to be convinced that he could eventually be a 3-down player by 2010 at SLB, replacing Rashad Jeanty with equal run-stopping ability. You cannot select a 2-down (or less) defensive player as a Top 10 pick.

I mean no disrespect when I say this....but I really enjoyed reading how you came to the same conclusions I came to several months ago. Where we seem to differ is in regards to the prospects themselves. I see Orakpo as a true blue chipper, perhaps the last one that will be available, and I'm confident he could play either role. So I can't ignore him at #6 despite the fact that the fit isn't as easy as I'd like. Rather, my opinion of Orakpo trumps those concerns. By comparison, I have absolutely no love for Todd McShay's idea of drafting Maybin at #6 precisely because I don't think Maybin can as easily convert to OLB and will never be a 3-down DE. Furthermore, if all things are equal I take Orakpo over Monroe, Raji, and now Crabtree.