FINAL Mock Draft Big Board 4/29

[HoosierCat]

Is this mock included on your "big board"?

Yes.

[Bobcat Bengal]

Hmm....I've finally gotten around to pimping a first round prospect, two actually.

Those two are Donte Whitner, and Antonio Cromartie.

We pick 24th, what a coincidence that the two players I'm backing are ranked 23rd and 24th overall (at least according to NFL Draft Countdown)

23. Donte Whitner S Ohio St.

24. Antonio Cromartie CB Florida St.

Starting to look good.....although somehow I have the feeling that they might be picked far ahead of the rankings they are assigned.

[Bengalbob]

I would love to see one pick change in the Bengals mock drafts...Chris Gocong DE. He is this years Pollack, but without the big school, big play rep that Pollack had. Personally, I don't think it would be wise for the Bengals to take another tweener at this time.

Gocong going to the Bengals in the 3rd round as a DE should have only a slightly higher probability of happening than him being invited to play "Machine Gun" at the 1st Baptist Church of McDonald Pennsylvannia.

So far there's no reports that teams are looking at him as a 4-3 DE. His Pro Day workout led by Ricky Hunley featured only 3 teams per Gil Brandt, who added that only 4 other teams -- 3-4 ones -- had set private workouts to evaluate his tweener tranisition to OLB. If only 7 teams are really interested in Gocong, that low of a number would have to push him down deeper into Day 2.

However, that perception of Gocong as a tweener who will have to jump to 3-4 seems a bit narrow to me, even though it should help his draft stock. Gocong is only a half inch shorter than Tamba Hali but makes up for it with 9 inches more on his vertical. Gocong was the same weight at the Combine as Hali was at his Pro Day --263 pounds. And Gocong raised the bar 28 times compared to Hali's 18. When the short area measurables get added into it, Gocong is a lot more like Dwight Freeney than Hali ever could be.

Anyway, meet Mr. Gocong: http://www.atlantafalcons.com/team/article.jsp?id=11093

The Falcon's have a sweet Combine section! That said, I couldn't get any sound of the player interview videos. Any suggestions?

[schweinhart]

Sounds like a great guy, with potential, but I stand by my statement that I don't thnk he's the type of player the Bengals need right now. If we wanted someone like him to be an end, then we could move Pollack back and have Simmons, Thurman, and Johnson as our starting LBs.....or add Arrington.

Pollack did see his share of action at DE and IIRC all but maybe one of his sacks came from there. But whether the Bengals decide to use Pollack more there or not, this draft should address the pass rush off the edge. It has got to get better.

A tweener like Gocong or Stanley McClover or Parys Haralson or Mark Anderson etc. should get looked at hard, especially those who have the best space skills because it will generate more blitz options if they've got a DE who can effectively drop back in short area coverage for either Pollack or one of these tweeners to fly in more. It also infuses the defense with the personnel needed to run even more 3 man fronts than the Bengals did last year where the QB would be forced to account for 5 including 2 DE/OLBs off the edges. The end result would be more sacks and a lot more 3 step drops where the DBs and coverage LBs can jump even more routes for picks. Of these types I've seen this year, Gocong looks best suited to bring this dimension because he stands to be a truer DE than the pack including others rated higher like Wimbley and Lawson because of his strong quickness on inside moves and ability to ride blockers back to the QB on the outside without losing balance or leverage.

Besides, Smith and Jumpy Jr. just ain't cutting it. Justin's switch to LDE had all the trappings of leading to a double-digit sack season. Yet he didn't come close. Jumpy looked much better in limited action at LDE in 2004 than he did the whole season at RDE last year where he's just not quick enough to get by LTs and somewhat slow on contain. He's looking more like Carl Powell's replacement than the starting DE to me. Add to it that Justin is playing the last year of his contract and there's plenty there to warrant drafting a DE, which Gocong still looks like to me first and foremost.

[schweinhart]

The Falcon's have a sweet Combine section! That said, I couldn't get any sound of the player interview videos. Any suggestions?

Dunno about the sound but it is good to see teams shed some inside light on the combine through their websites.

[wookie]

Pollack did see his share of action at DE and IIRC all but maybe one of his sacks came from there. But whether the Bengals decide to use Pollack more there or not, this draft should address the pass rush off the edge. It has got to get better.

A tweener like Gocong or Stanley McClover or Parys Haralson or Mark Anderson etc. should get looked at hard, especially those who have the best space skills because it will generate more blitz options if they've got a DE who can effectively drop back in short area coverage for either Pollack or one of these tweeners to fly in more. It also infuses the defense with the personnel needed to run even more 3 man fronts than the Bengals did last year where the QB would be forced to account for 5 including 2 DE/OLBs off the edges. The end result would be more sacks and a lot more 3 step drops where the DBs and coverage LBs can jump even more routes for picks. Of these types I've seen this year, Gocong looks best suited to bring this dimension because he stands to be a truer DE than the pack including others rated higher like Wimbley and Lawson because of his strong quickness on inside moves and ability to ride blockers back to the QB on the outside without losing balance or leverage.

Besides, Smith and Jumpy Jr. just ain't cutting it. Justin's switch to LDE had all the trappings of leading to a double-digit sack season. Yet he didn't come close. Jumpy looked much better in limited action at LDE in 2004 than he did the whole season at RDE last year where he's just not quick enough to get by LTs and somewhat slow on contain. He's looking more like Carl Powell's replacement than the starting DE to me. Add to it that Justin is playing the last year of his contract and there's plenty there to warrant drafting a DE, which Gocong still looks like to me first and foremost.

Well, Justin Smith has a weakness for being able to defeat the double team. Last season teams were able to double team him a lot and keep him off the QB. With Adams on board they are going to have to double team him a lot more and that should lead to more sacks from Smith.

Geathers was also seeing time at DT on passing downs and didn't get to rush from the outside as much. If allowed to get more playing time overall, and all or a majority of snaps from the end position I think his production will also go up.

I'm all for drafting a DE, I'm just not as confident as you are that Gocong is the DE we need...or that he will play DE in the NFL.

[schweinhart]

I'm all for drafting a DE, I'm just not as confident as you are that Gocong is the DE we need...or that he will play DE in the NFL.

I hear you. But I'll stand by what I said about Gocong after the East-West Shrine Game with the exception that IMO Gocong does have the skill set to stand as a 4-3 DE alone if need be.

3. Chris Gocong OLB: Good God. One of the best things about watching these games, even with the limitations of what the players can and can't do scheme wise, is to see the players who are clearly better than the others. Gocong is one of these players. At undersized DE, his speed rush and suprising power makes him real intriguing. His ability to get out into the flats for swing passes is highly impressive. He'll have to show teams at the combine that he can play backer but there's no reason to think he won't well enough to crack Day 1.

I'll add that I think he is a perfect fit for the Bengals.

[bengalboomer7]

"Gocong, Gocong" Sounds like those Huge gold plates in Chinese movies

"Gocong" Is that church bells

[HoosierCat]

Early update this week, as I'm going to be offline for a few days. Lots of shuffling on the Big Board this week as mockers around the 'net absorb the signing of FA DT Sam Adams. Leonard Pope becomes the first non-DT to top the Big Board. Marcedes Lewis also makes a comeback, and there are now more defensive backs than you can shake a football at.

TE Leonard Pope 14 (+4)

DT Gabe Watson 11 (-6)

S Donte Whitner 4 (+2)

TE Marcedes Lewis 3 (+3)

DE Mathais Kiwanuka 3 (+1)

DT Rodrique Wright 3 (no change)

S Darnell Bing 2 (+1)

S Jason Allen 2 (+1)

DE Manny Lawson 2 (+1)

CB Ashton Youboty 2 (no change)

DE Tamba Hali 2 (-3)

DT Brodrick Bunkley 2 (-4)

CB Antonio Cromartie 1 (+1)

DE Kamerion Wimbley 1 (+1)

S Daniel Bullocks 1 (+1)

WR Santonio Holmes 1 (no change)

DB Jimmy Williams 1 (no change)

DT Jesse Mahelona 1 (no change)

S Ko Simpson 1 (no change)

DT Claude Wroten 1 (-1)

By Position:

DT 18 (-11)

TE 17 (+7)

DB 14 (+6)

DE 8 (no change)

WR 1 (no change)

In the second, we have 23 mocks with selections. The leaders are:

TE Marcedes Lewis 3 (no change)

TE Dominique Byrd 3 (no change)

S Daniel Bullocks 2 (+1)

DT Rodrique Wright 2 (+1)

Then 13 players with 1 vote each. Positionally, the leaders in the 2nd are:

TE 9 (+1)

DT 5 (+1)

DB 6 (+2)

DE 2 (no change)

WR 1 (no change)

[schweinhart]

"Gocong, Gocong" Sounds like those Huge gold plates in Chinese movies

"Gocong" Is that church bells

It's gonna sound like music to somebody's ears.

Gil Brandt has got Gocong as his wildcard DE of the draft: http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9359993

Whatever happens with him, he'll leave some Purple Haze drifting around inside of some QB heads.

[ArmyBengal]

"Gocong, Gocong" Sounds like those Huge gold plates in Chinese movies

"Gocong" Is that church bells

he'll leave some Purple Haze drifting around inside of some QB heads.

Don't we have enough "purple haze" in Henry's head ???

WHODEY !!!

[Whur CHad At?]

Don't like the Bengalszone Mock at all

[schweinhart]

Don't like the Bengalszone Mock at all

Easy to see why. Cromartie only only picked in 1 mock on the Big Board and that must be the Zone Mock. Course if it had Ko on it then there would be 2 mocks out there with him on it. Not that I don't like Ko but it does beg the question:

Whur Ko Choo Choo At?

[HoosierCat]

With the draft now just two weeks away, mock drafters are coming into the home stretch -- but as far as the Bengals are concerned, they are more undecided than ever! Leonard Pope sprinted out into the lead in the wake of the Sam Adams signing, but a week later he is falling back. Gabe "Fatman" Watson continues to hang in at the top of the board. This week's climber, tho, is S Donte Whitner, followed by Kiwanuka

While voting fractured badly over the past week, with five guys jumping into that 3-4 vote range, it's notable that the net impact positionally was to push defensive back to the top of the positional list for the first time. DE is also rising, while fewer mockers are projecting a DT or TE in the first.

TE Leonard Pope 11 (-3)

DT Gabe Watson 10 (-1)

S Donte Whitner 7 (+3)

DE Mathais Kiwanuka 5 (+2)

DE Tamba Hali 4 (+2)

TE Marcedes Lewis 4 (+1)

S Jason Allen 3 (+1)

CB Ashton Youboty 3 (+1)

DT Brodrick Bunkley 3 (+1)

CB Antonio Cromartie 2 (+1)

S Darnell Bing 2 (no change)

DE Manny Lawson 2 (no change)

DT Rodrique Wright 2 (-1)

LB Thomas Howard 1 (+1)

CB Tye Hill 1 (+1)

DE Kamerion Wimbley 1 (no change)

DB Jimmy Williams 1 (no change)

S Ko Simpson 1 (no change)

DT Claude Wroten 1 (no change)

By Position:

DB 20 (+6)

DT 16 (-2)

TE 15 (-2)

DE 12 (+4)

LB 1 (+1)

In the second, we have 26 mocks with selections. The leaders are:

TE Dominique Byrd 4 (+1)

TE Joe Klopfenstein 2 (+1)

DT Jesse Mahelona 2 (+1)

DT Claude Wroten 2 (+1)

DT John McCargo 2 (+1)

TE Anthony Fasano 2 (no change)

Then 12 players with 1 vote each. Positionally, the leaders in the 2nd are:

TE 10 (+1)

DT 8 (+3)

DB 4 (-2)

DE 3 (+1)

WR 1 (no change)

[bengalboomer7]

We need an applause smiley for ya Joisey, standing ovation style.

Kudos to you for keeping up with this, it's been good info

I'd be happy with Whitner, but everyone knows my guy is Manny Lawson!!!

[HoosierCat]

Thanks, boomer. It's been fun following all the ups and downs and if other people find it informative or just entertaining, that's great.

Quick note: I updated the numbers just a minute ago -- ran across 3 mocks I didn't have listed (GM Jr., NFL Draft Almanac and The Huddle Report's draft machine). As a result Pope, Watson and Kiwanuka each picked up another vote in the first, and Byrd and McCargo got another vote each in the second.

[HairOnFire]

While voting fractured badly over the past week, with five guys jumping into that 3-4 vote range, it's notable that the net impact positionally was to push defensive back to the top of the positional list for the first time. DE is also rising, while fewer mockers are projecting a DT or TE in the first.

Just for the record, my battle tattered flag still proudly flyys above Camp CB.

Frankly, I knew that if I remained steadfast and prickish much of the world would eventually come to believe the very things I have been preaching for months. To be fair, I'm not patting myself on the back. I'm simply taking confort knowing that when I'm proven wrong I'll have far more company than when we began.

[HoosierCat]

While voting fractured badly over the past week, with five guys jumping into that 3-4 vote range, it's notable that the net impact positionally was to push defensive back to the top of the positional list for the first time. DE is also rising, while fewer mockers are projecting a DT or TE in the first.

Just for the record, my battle tattered flag still proudly flyys above Camp CB.

The odd thing to my mind is that while the defensive backfield has take center stage positionally, it's safety, not cornerback, that's getting the love. Probably a result of us being down at 24 and a consensus that the elite CBs will be off the board by then. Like I noted elsewhere, if they go CB they could do worse than Yobouty...if he's there. Gabe Watson I will still happily pocket. Whitner works for me. No DE's I really like at 24. Pope I will learn to live with.

[Bengalbob]

With the draft now just two weeks away, mock drafters are coming into the home stretch -- but as far as the Bengals are concerned, they are more undecided than ever! Leonard Pope sprinted out into the lead in the wake of the Sam Adams signing, but a week later he is falling back. Gabe "Fatman" Watson continues to hang in at the top of the board. This week's climber, tho, is S Donte Whitner, followed by Kiwanuka

While voting fractured badly over the past week, with five guys jumping into that 3-4 vote range, it's notable that the net impact positionally was to push defensive back to the top of the positional list for the first time. DE is also rising, while fewer mockers are projecting a DT or TE in the first.

TE Leonard Pope 11 (-3)

DT Gabe Watson 10 (-1)

S Donte Whitner 7 (+3)

DE Mathais Kiwanuka 5 (+2)

DE Tamba Hali 4 (+2)

TE Marcedes Lewis 4 (+1)

S Jason Allen 3 (+1)

CB Ashton Youboty 3 (+1)

DT Brodrick Bunkley 3 (+1)

CB Antonio Cromartie 2 (+1)

S Darnell Bing 2 (no change)

DE Manny Lawson 2 (no change)

DT Rodrique Wright 2 (-1)

LB Thomas Howard 1 (+1)

CB Tye Hill 1 (+1)

DE Kamerion Wimbley 1 (no change)

DB Jimmy Williams 1 (no change)

S Ko Simpson 1 (no change)

DT Claude Wroten 1 (no change)

By Position:

DB 20 (+6)

DT 16 (-2)

TE 15 (-2)

DE 12 (+4)

LB 1 (+1)

In the second, we have 26 mocks with selections. The leaders are:

TE Dominique Byrd 4 (+1)

TE Joe Klopfenstein 2 (+1)

DT Jesse Mahelona 2 (+1)

DT Claude Wroten 2 (+1)

DT John McCargo 2 (+1)

TE Anthony Fasano 2 (no change)

Then 12 players with 1 vote each. Positionally, the leaders in the 2nd are:

TE 10 (+1)

DT 8 (+3)

DB 4 (-2)

DE 3 (+1)

WR 1 (no change)

Joisey, you may have already seen this, but for those who haven't, here is a site that is doing some of the same analysis that Joisey is doing for all the teams and 1st/2nd round players:

http://www.fanmonster.com/public/muncher/S...lt.asp?site=211

[HairOnFire]

The odd thing to my mind is that while the defensive backfield has take center stage positionally, it's safety, not cornerback, that's getting the love. Probably a result of us being down at 24 and a consensus that the elite CBs will be off the board by then.

True enough. Based upon the way mock drafts have changed we've gone from me arguing with nearly everyone that Tye Hill would be a great pick at #24 to my having almost no hope at all that he'll still be available. But even if he's off the board I think there will be at least one pure CB available...although the Bengals may not like the choice and as a result could easily look at other positions.

[Section 310]

[HoosierCat]

Based upon the way mock drafts have changed we've gone from me arguing with nearly everyone that Tye Hill would be a great pick at #24 to my having almost no hope at all that he'll still be available. But even if he's off the board I think there will be at least one pure CB available...although the Bengals may not like the choice and as a result could easily look at other positions.

Only thing that bugs me about Hill is his less-than-ideal size, but I wouldn't argue if he was the pick. But yeah, he has pretty consistently been going in the teens in most of the mocks. In fact, he lost his single vote on the Big Board today when Fromzack at eastcoastsports.com switched his projection to Kiwanuka.

[Spor_tees]

Robb Hoff from Bengalzone is one of the mock's they used...

[TecmoFever]

I noticed that there were three mocks that had us getting Bunkley. How in the world is he going to fall that far to us?

[ArmyBengal]

I noticed that there were three mocks that had us getting Bunkley. How in the world is he going to fall that far to us?

I don't know, but that sure would be great in my book !!!

WHODEY !!!