General AFC North thread

[ShulaSteakhouse]

On 7/6/2022 at 10:42 PM, ArmyBengal said:

I saw that as well. I’m rooting for Baker to have a career game, throwing for over 450 yards, 4 TD’s and no picks while blowing out the Browns 45-7.

Won’t happen, but damn I would pay extra just to see Clowns fans absolutely lose their collective shit.

 

Mayfield is a douche, but I will probably also root for him vs the Clowns and their suspended, pervert QB.  And well you always want to see a division opponent lose.  They did do him kinda dirty.   That said Watson is clearly an upgrade to Mayfield, it's just how it was handled.

[HoosierCat]

Lol

 

[ArmyBengal]

Naming rights are amusing to me.  Everything gets a name and sponsor.

Stadiums and even things which don't physically exist like the red zone.
"The Bengals have just entered the Toyota red zone" or whomever the sponsor is.

I can't help but wonder what's next?  Maybe sections in the stadium.
"I got my season tickets in the 5th row of the Kellogg Cereal section."
"That's awesome, I struggled to afford tickets this year and ended up in the Axe Body Spray section."
"No issue though the Department of Corrections Wi-Fi is strongest in that part of the stadium."

All the while the money just keeps flowing in.

Much respect to the Bengals for Paul Brown stadium !!!

[HoosierCat]

I always thought the Dick’s Locker Room was a sponsorship waiting to happen…

[COB]

I’ve always expected the next level will be the nfl selling team names.  Like the Cleveland Progressive Insurance Football Club, or they’ll drop the city name and sell that, like the Progressive Insurance Browns.  
 

So we’ll have Microsoft playing Budweiser.  Might as well just do it.  It’s a purely commercial enterprise now anyway, the concept of an NFL team really representing a city is pure fiction at this point.  They’ll pack up and leave when it suits them, the owner gets a better deal and they gone.  

[HoosierCat]

Yikes. Evidence must be ugly.

 

[ArmyBengal]

The Texans simply made it go away.

Ugly but smart. Nothing to see here…

[ArmyBengal]

So Watson gets a 6 game suspension to start the 2022 season.
We don't play the Browns until week 8, so we will see Watson twice this season.
I don't think it really matters, they need to work harder at beating the Browns regardless.
Mayfield always did well playing against us, so it's whatever to me.

I can see the league appealing this however.
It was reported they wanted 12 games during attempts to settle.

[membengal]

What a joke.

[HoosierCat]

6 games, no fine. What a joke.

[ArmyBengal]

The 6 games with no fine associated ??
Ridiculous, but not really surprised either.
We will see if the league appeals.

[HoosierCat]

Imagine if he was a Bengals player. He’d be suspended until the end of time, all the rest of the roster would be suspended for a year just because, the coaches would all have to work for free in soup kitchens all season and Mike Brown would be fined so much he’d have to sell the team to Elon Musk, who would rename them the Cincinnati Martians.

[AMPHAR]

I take the opposite approach.  NFL should not be involved in matters that can't bring criminal charges.     It is clear that you can be a dirt ball and be great a football. 

Who knows what your player population is involved in? NFL policies allow accusers to go after players that may or may not be involved in some unsavory but not criminal behavior.     Where does it stop and who's moral code do you use?

Criminal matters at least have a baseline.  Then the NFL can decide what to do after a criminal review.     Just dumb they get themselves caught up in these scandals.

They should never set the standard above the justice system.  It is impossible to manage and if they take extreme measures they'll find themselves constantly in labor court. 

 

[HoosierCat]

Labor court? Lol. This is ‘Murica, land of the free, home of at will employment. Maybe there’s a world out there where what you do outside of work has no impact on your job, but it sure isn’t this one. If anything, the NFL has far less accountability and (as seen here) far gentler consequences than your average business. This kind of stuff comes up, they just fire you and get on with their day. Watson gets six weeks’ unpaid vacation. Rough life.

[AMPHAR]

9 minutes ago, HoosierCat said:

Labor court? Lol. This is ‘Murica, land of the free, home of at will employment. Maybe there’s a world out there where what you do outside of work has no impact on your job, but it sure isn’t this one. If anything, the NFL has far less accountability and (as seen here) far gentler consequences than your average business. This kind of stuff comes up, they just fire you and get on with their day. Watson gets six weeks’ unpaid vacation. Rough life.

No maybe about it.   There is a whole world of anit-trust stuff that makes the reality of the NFL completely opposite of what you describe.   I'm not an expert but somewhere along the line they point to a collectively bargained agreement to help avoid the reality of their monopoly.    

So they have to follow their policy.     

Now they could change the policy in the next go round of labor negotiations and try to give more power to the owners.  

However, the biggest problem the NFL can't stop a player from employment opportunity.    That decision is left up to the individual franchise. 

So it is physically impossible to stop the flow of players into the league that likes beating up women, driving drunk, rub and tugs, hookers, nose candy or whatever.

They have to let them in IF a team drafts them or signs to a contract.    Then they have follow the agreed upon procedure. 

It is that hard reality that makes Goodell's take on behavior completely stupid, IMO.   He always going to have a scandal to deal with.  He could lessen that by setting the bar of behavior at the criminal level. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[HoosierCat]

Lol. Colin Kapernick would like a word.

[AMPHAR]

2 hours ago, HoosierCat said:

Lol. Colin Kapernick would like a word.

lol.  Colin has had plenty of words and no balls.   If he was black balled by the league then were is his fight for justice?  

The fact is the NFL cannot start black balling players outside their policy.    They could push for a stronger policy but the players will balk and if the disagreement gets strong enough the players can threaten to dissolve the union.

Then both sides wake up and realize that the risk of doing that isn't going to produce a reward greater than what they have today.

We have seen this dance several times.

IMO, the NFL would be much better prepared to deal with public opinions if they would structure their policy so the legal system becomes the baseline. 

Why are people questioning the NFL when none of Watson's actions are going to result in criminal charge?    Just a dumb thought process, IMO. 

 

[COB]

Very unique viewpoint : bury head in sand, let bad behavior sully your league’s reputation, damaging your bottom line.  

[Wraith]

Godell has final say on this punishment.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Who knows if legal/labor reasons prevented more games, or if the NFL just didn't want to destroy Cleveland for a year.   They did limit his massages to "staff approved" people only, lol, and no more trouble with law enforcement.  

He wasn't found guilty of a crime, settled with most of the women, not sure if it's all fair or not,  so whatever.   At least with a drug suspension, there's a clear violation of rules and usually multiple infractions over time. (other than MJ which is just stupid) 

 

Edit: Not to make light of sexual misconduct/assault/harrassment of course.   It would just be embarrassing to have to check with his employer before getting a massage. which is kind of funny, and humiliating.

[AMPHAR]

18 hours ago, COB said:

Very unique viewpoint : bury head in sand, let bad behavior sully your league’s reputation, damaging your bottom line.  

It is not burying your head in the sand at all.   It is simply redirecting the mob to a more appropriate place to voice their displeasure of what they see as injustice.  It probably saves a bunch of NFL fans from having to listen to a bunch of reactionary BS.

To listen to sports media focus on 6 games is confusing.    If you truly believe Watson is a sexual predator or whatever.  Damaging the league.  Then what amount of games reconciles that?   Why is 17 games justice? 30?  Lifetime?  

For a complex issue as this is and several before it.   It is easier to manage if you construct your path of action on the basis of a system that has due process and widely known classification of infractions.   Then you can leverage that system to manage your own procedures and punishments. 

Watson will not be the last. 

[ArmyBengal]

I think that's a good question... 
How many games reconciles whatever someone wants to believe is/was wrong?

This is why, for the most part, I don't hate lawyers despite hearing that from damn near everyone.
I have no idea, and don't think others do either, about the letter of the law.  I need that person that does.

Regarding Watson's situation, I simply feel this was something egregious and deserving of a whole season.  Granted, he wasn't found guilty of any criminal charges, but I don't think there are many, if any, people who think he's completely innocent either.  Then what is the league precedence for this situation?  Is there one?  If someone felt what he did was deserving of more than a season long suspension, I would begin to argue that dude needs to be kicked out of the league.

Thing is, no one gives a shit about how I, or anyone else "feels" about it.
That's one reason I said, it's neither here nor there for me.

[AMPHAR]

I would say kick these type of players out of the league and try to prevent them from gaining access.  The NFL is the land of opportunity, IMO, it is not that big of an ask to have players avoid this type of stuff. 

But, the league can not do that without the NFLPA agreeing to a more strict behavior policy.

What kind of labor fight that causes is speculative.  The current policy is less restrictive than the previous so going backwards is unlikely. 

I think you would find common ground by using the legal system as a baseline.   There is due process there.  There is a classification of infractions.  There is formal investigation etc.

Then the league can say, hey they are being charged for a felony they are suspended until resolved.  They aren't being charged therefore we are clear.  Misdemeanor carries a game or whatever.  They can vary escalation from there.    That takes away the media's appetite to cover these things day in and day out.    Grey area stuff unfortunately falls by the way side and we all move on.

But in this country sex offenders AFTER serving their sentence have to register etc.  I'm sure their sentence is more harsh than missing 6,8,17 or whatever weeks of football.   Yet as a society we have deemed even after serving these sentences there are more protections needed.    I just don't get the viewpoints being expressed that accuse Watson of extreme behavior to favor his accusers but then conclude well 17 games is alright, huh?   Missing 17 weeks of football makes it alright?  Go ahead and buy your Watson jersey after 17 weeks, he's a role model now.   Just fucking stupid.

So if you are not going to try to cure the problem (players and owners) then don't bother my football addiction with this middle ground bullcrap.   If he's free then he can play. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[COB]

If the legal system is your baseline, you are forfeiting your chance to control the image and reputation of the NFL.

 

The NFL is an entertainment business, and billions of dollars are involved.  They are trying to grow interest in the game to women, not exclusively, but it’s important to them.  
 

The legal system is an inconsistent, unreliable measuring stick.  Watson is an example.  Mega rich, his lawyers got involved with the grand jury proceedings and killed the whole thing.  
 

The NFL is a business.  Turning your public image over to a bunch of 22 year olds, some of whom by their very nature are prone to violence, that’s just not a realistic strategy.  
 

You could be a PR nightmare, the worst person in the world to be representing a business, and still not break any laws.  

[HoosierCat]