2020 Draft

[AMPHAR]

Quote

PROS: Absolute war daddy who can beat interior defenders in so many different ways. He's nimble, light footed and fluid when he's looking to play out in space or scrape laterally to get leverage on reach blocks. Alternatively, he'll uproot defenders in drive block situations with good leg drive, effective lower body power and a potent punch. Grip strength and hand placement are effective, he'll turn you out of gaps in short order thanks to how tight he keeps bodies in close quarters. Scheme transcendent player with terrific football IQ already despite just being a RS Sophomore in 2018. 

CONS: Will have a hard time finding persistent issues on film -- I genuinely feel he would have been the top interior offensive lineman in the 2018 NFL Draft had he chose to declare and enter early. Pedigree at Wisconsin has groomed him for life on the big stage but playing in such a run heavy offense could mask some technical issues given volume of work playing forward or resetting the LOS. I doubt it, though. All around stud of a player. 

Who was the top interior lineman in the 2018 Draft?  Nelson.   Maybe it was a typo?

So is this where we are at right now?  We are going to pretend that we'll be dissatisfied landing this stud on draft day?     You can go right to last year's Drew Sample thread and see the reality.     

At first it's  "What the Fuck?".   "Who?".    Then it's oh this guy says this and it's OK.

I'm just telling you right now.  They trade down and grab Tua, Wills, and Biadasz.   I'm a happy guy.

lol, at this guy's "CON". 

[AMPHAR]

8 minutes ago, membengal said:

Sample sucked. Just saying, a Big 10 lineman with anchor issues in the interior seems sub-optimal to me. Take it up with Kyle Crabbs and those folks at TDN.  

Won't need to because IF that guy ever becomes a Bengal you'll do it for me.   I know it and you know it.   So move on and DREAM HIGHER>

 

[membengal]

I have my QB - you are the one being a massive dumbfuck and finding ways for this to team to fuck it up.  So fuck off. 

[AMPHAR]

1 minute ago, membengal said:

I have my QB - you are the one being a massive dumbfuck and finding ways for this to team to fuck it up.  So fuck off. 

This doesn't set off any red flags, does it? 

You realize you'll have to share Burrow with the rest of us, right? 

 

 

[AMPHAR]

16 minutes ago, membengal said:

AMPHAR, you are going on ignore for the duration of the draft season because you kinda suck. 

Please do this.    In minutes I can find positive draft write ups about Tyler Biadasz and share them.     Your reaction?

Launch a cuss word filled tirade.      Very weird.   If you don't want to talk draft, then don't talk draft.   Hang out in the Burrow thread.  (Which by the way I love the thought of getting Burrow).

You are sitting here on this board throwing jabs at me for the mere suggestion of trading back.    WTF?

 

[Stripes]

Anyway. Something else to talk about... literally anything...

How about:

When we are mocking the 7-round draft, who will be the goofy-ass Drew Sample pick of 2020? I hope it isn't at #33, but I know better than to hope. I have a weird intuition hitting me right now that it'll be a running back.

[membengal]

6 minutes ago, AMPHAR said:

This doesn't set off any red flags, does it? 

You realize you'll have to share Burrow with the rest of us, right? 

 

 

Everyone gets to enjoy him but you, in fact. Hope you are right on Biadsz if they take him. He's not without risk, as with any draft pick. Under no circumstances should anyone be happy with a draft where he's part of a first round trade back scenario where they don't take Burrow. 

[AMPHAR]

18 minutes ago, Stripes said:

Anyway. Something else to talk about... literally anything...

How about:

When we are mocking the 7-round draft, who will be the goofy-ass Drew Sample pick of 2020? I hope it isn't at #33, but I know better than to hope. I have a weird intuition hitting me right now that it'll be a running back.

I think it will be CB.   Dennard is FA.  B.W. just alright.   I think Dre is more solid than he gets credit for but also has decent size cap number.

I'm hoping a Mixon extension is coming in August.

[AMPHAR]

33 minutes ago, membengal said:

Everyone gets to enjoy him but you, in fact. Hope you are right on Biadsz if they take him. He's not without risk, as with any draft pick. Under no circumstances should anyone be happy with a draft where he's part of a first round trade back scenario where they don't take Burrow. 

Dude.  I'm neither right or wrong on him.    I got a crazy thought in my head about Miami trading all 3 No. 1s for No. 1 overall.    This one particular mock had those 3 players going to Miami which would undoubtedly be one of the top graded drafts IF it were to happen.   

I saw him play a couple time this past year.   Looked up some profiles and thought "Hell Yeah!"   

So yeah,  I would be happy with Tua, Wills, and Biadasz.    

How you react is up to you.   All I know is I can find in the Drew Sample thread YOU coming to positive terms with that selection based on draft write ups. I did too.  That is what fans do.    It is also fact that more than 1 team will walk away with an awesome draft and there's many ways to do it.

So if you want to attack me for discussing draft scenarios.   Have at it, but I think you should follow your own advice and put me on ignore because I'm not going to suspend reality to accommodate your love affair with Burrow.   

It is has been my experience the more draft scenarios posted the more familiar you get with prospects which then feeds your familiarity as you consume football and then the inevitable Free Agency period.

Landing Tua, Wills, and Biadasz would be a kick ass draft.  I don't give a shit who disagrees with me pre-draft because I know for a fact IF that reality ever hits people would shit their pants (in a good way).    

 

[COB]

I wonder if Mike fears a fan insurrection should he lose his senses and trade the Burrow pick.  He should.  

Stripes is right, Not Burrow could actually lower attendance.  I would not only participate in the “you traded the Burrow pick so fuck you” rebellion, I would gladly lead it.

[membengal]

9 minutes ago, AMPHAR said:

 

Landing Tua, Wills, and Biadasz would be a kick ass draft.  I don't give a shit who disagrees with me pre-draft because I know for a fact IF that reality ever hits people would shit their pants (in a good way).    

 

It's not enough, it's not NEAR enough. Tua with the injury history would be a walking injury timebomb, and this team is certainly capable of missing on line prospects, no matter what their write-ups. I believe you are being more than a little blase about the costs of passing up Burrow, and any exercise that doesn't end with this team having a literal historic haul to trade out is not serious. Even with a historic haul I would not trade out. COB is right from his above post - passing on Burrow will come with a massive cost. 

[AMPHAR]

28 minutes ago, membengal said:

It's not enough, it's not NEAR enough. Tua with the injury history would be a walking injury timebomb, and this team is certainly capable of missing on line prospects, no matter what their write-ups. I believe you are being more than a little blase about the costs of passing up Burrow, and any exercise that doesn't end with this team having a literal historic haul to trade out is not serious. Even with a historic haul I would not trade out. COB is right from his above post - passing on Burrow will come with a massive cost. 

Bust potential exist for Joe Burrow too.    If you can read a draft profile like Biadasz's that grades him higher than Nelson, compares him to current All-Pros AND is coming from a program with a crazy good track record of producing NFL Players at those positions and your response is "this team is certainly capable missing"

Joe Burrow had to transfer out of Ohio State to play.  He got turned down by Nebraska for Christ Sakes and had an ALL-TIME YEAR at LSU.   How does that not factor into your thinking?  Aren't the Bengals capable of going all in on Burrow and missing?  Yes.

I think Joe Burrow is the real deal.   I think that of Tua as well.   Herbert looked damn good in his Rose Bowl.

IF you want to handicap the draft by adding a "BENGAL" factor there is far more greater risk in this franchise going "All-In" on Burrow vs. a trade down scenario.   At the end of the day I'm not against drafting Burrow at all.     I'm trying to build the best team and playing reality.

Under the trade scenario landing Tua, Wills, and Biadasz would be awesome too.

 

 

 

[HoosierCat]

1 hour ago, Stripes said:

Anyway. Something else to talk about... literally anything...

How about:

When we are mocking the 7-round draft, who will be the goofy-ass Drew Sample pick of 2020? I hope it isn't at #33, but I know better than to hope. I have a weird intuition hitting me right now that it'll be a running back.

I’ll say it will be our third round pick and it will be a linebacker. Some kid from West Bumfungle Community College who’s ranked like 187th on the list of LBs but has some supposed freak skill like blocking field goals (waves at Margus Hunt) and is gonna be this awesome find everyone else missed except he gets cut at the end of camp, hangs around the taxi squad for a couple years and is never heard from again.

[AMPHAR]

30 minutes ago, COB said:

I wonder if Mike fears a fan insurrection should he lose his senses and trade the Burrow pick.  He should.  

Stripes is right, Not Burrow could actually lower attendance.  I would not only participate in the “you traded the Burrow pick so fuck you” rebellion, I would gladly lead it.

Bengals were at Utah State and LSU early in the year.   The squawk box has confirmed the Burrow/Bengal connection via Nebraska and that's been going on since before the end of the season.

I think we'll find out they've been sold on him for a while.   I don't think the mini Burrow uprising in Cincinnati since the National Championship game factors in it at all.

[membengal]

Frankly, the goofy ass Drew Sample pick is why suggestions to trade back, pass on Burrow and amass picks leaves me so frustrated. I do NOT trust Tobin to get those extra picks right. I would so much rather they take what is, by universal acclaim, as close to a sure thing as you can find in this draft other than Chase Young, at the premium position of QB and then see what they can find later. I do not want to see a whole Tobin draft of Samples for Joe Burrow. 

[AMPHAR]

10 minutes ago, membengal said:

Frankly, the goofy ass Drew Sample pick is why suggestions to trade back, pass on Burrow and amass picks leaves me so frustrated. I do NOT trust Tobin to get those extra picks right. I would so much rather they take what is, by universal acclaim, as close to a sure thing as you can find in this draft other than Chase Young, at the premium position of QB and then see what they can find later. I do not want to see a whole Tobin draft of Samples for Joe Burrow. 

Again the opposite is true.   Tobin and Co.  can't take Burrow then add a bunch of Drew Samples either.   That's why trade scenarios are fun to talk about and probably need to be considered because there is a recent draft failure rate for this franchise.

Burrow could be All-World QB and you can still land a Pro Bowl QB and some key pieces.    

[HoosierCat]

11 minutes ago, membengal said:

Frankly, the goofy ass Drew Sample pick is why suggestions to trade back, pass on Burrow and amass picks leaves me so frustrated. I do NOT trust Tobin to get those extra picks right. I would so much rather they take what is, by universal acclaim, as close to a sure thing as you can find in this draft other than Chase Young, at the premium position of QB and then see what they can find later. I do not want to see a whole Tobin draft of Samples for Joe Burrow. 

Yeah that’s a point. Indulging the personnel office’s tendencies toward...creative...decisions is probably a bad idea. That said, it wouldn’t concern me too much if we’re talking about a pile of first round picks. Their skimpy scouting tends to bite them in later rounds.

I think they will keep the pick and take Burrow. It makes a ton of sense from multiple angles. Not only is he a top prospect, they’ll get praise from the media, the fans already love him and will flock back to the stadium and the pro shop to buy his jersey, etc. And given that there are other strong QB candidates in this draft (and Lawrence waiting in the wings), it’s hard to see another team being willing to give up the treasure trove of picks required to pry the first out of the Bengals’ hands.

[AMPHAR]

24/7 draft site threw up an interesting mock.

1. Bengals grab Burrow No. 1 overall.    Pick #33 they have them taking Austin Jackson - T USC.    I agree with the position, not sure about the player.   Athletic tackles are scary after the Ced and Fisher failures.  

However at pick #34.   They have Justin Jefferson going.  

So that begs the question.    The Bengals WR core is unreliable at this point.   AJ (I assume comes back) has been great and HOF worthy career.  Hasn't played since November 2018 and will be 32 or something.   Ross ton of potential but a basket of inconsistency and injury.   Tate/Boyd/Erickson all have strengths but are not dynamic enough to dictate coverage by themselves.  

Jefferson would be a fringe steal at #34.  It would fit his MO because he was overlooked as a college recruit.   A target Burrow is obviously familiar with and has enough speed to draw coverage. 

OR do you build the O-line?  I prefer the Becton tackle at this point, but there are some others as well.

[HoosierCat]

I lean more toward OL than WR, tho there’s certainly an argument to be made for giving Burrow all the weapons. Especially since, as I’m sure Hobson will remind us, we have an “extra first round pick” who’s an OT.

[membengal]

8 minutes ago, HoosierCat said:

I lean more toward OL than WR, tho there’s certainly an argument to be made for giving Burrow all the weapons. Especially since, as I’m sure Hobson will remind us, we have an “extra first round pick” who’s an OT.

Other argument for a WR is that, depending on what happens with Green and Ross being at end up his rookie contract, that for 2021 the only WR they have under contract with any real experience are Boyd and Tate - maybe Erickson. 

[HoosierCat]

3 minutes ago, membengal said:

Other argument for a WR is that, depending on what happens with Green and Ross being at end up his rookie contract, that for 2021 the only WR they have under contract with any real experience are Boyd and Tate - maybe Erickson. 

Yup. It sure would be nice if they dipped a toe or two into FA in March and filled a hole or two ahead of the draft. I know, I know, crazy talk...

[TJJackson]

this is a pure hypothetical

Lets say that Tua never got injured and finished the season just as strongly as he had played up to the point where he was (in reality) injured.

Then lets say that we are offered overall pick 2 and a r2 plus a r3 pick this year or a r1 plus a r2 next year for our overall pick 1.

In that hypothetical, would you make that trade, essentially knowing you will get a fully healthy Tua and other high value players instead of just Burrow?

[Stripes]

No.

[membengal]

2 hours ago, TJJackson said:

this is a pure hypothetical

Lets say that Tua never got injured and finished the season just as strongly as he had played up to the point where he was (in reality) injured.

Then lets say that we are offered overall pick 2 and a r2 plus a r3 pick this year or a r1 plus a r2 next year for our overall pick 1.

In that hypothetical, would you make that trade, essentially knowing you will get a fully healthy Tua and other high value players instead of just Burrow?

No.

[AMPHAR]

3 hours ago, TJJackson said:

this is a pure hypothetical

Lets say that Tua never got injured and finished the season just as strongly as he had played up to the point where he was (in reality) injured.

Then lets say that we are offered overall pick 2 and a r2 plus a r3 pick this year or a r1 plus a r2 next year for our overall pick 1.

In that hypothetical, would you make that trade, essentially knowing you will get a fully healthy Tua and other high value players instead of just Burrow?

Yes.    Again a caveman approach to looking at the draft is equating all draft classes to be the same.   The 2nd best Qb this year is the same last year and next year so on and so on.

This class could produce more than 1 or 2 franchise QBs.  That is the true risk with Burrow.   Burrow may prove to be an All-Pro or just a really good QB.   So may another QB or QBs.    If that happens you passed on a chance to add multiple parts. 

Tua without injury concerns is every bit the QB prospect Burrow is and could easily end up being better. 

Everyone on this board know this to be true because above when I proposed my trade down idea and get Tua at 5.  The first rebuttal is what if a team jumps them at 5 for Tua?    If Tua isn't at that level then teams are not jumping the Dolphins at 5 to grab him.

In this scenario you are guaranteeing Burrow or Tua because you go no lower than 2 AND 2 extra top 100 players.   If Tua wasn't hurt that's a no brainer really.