Chad has lost the hunger

[BengalszoneBilly]

IMO Chad hasn't lost s**t. Being in the spotlight (be it on a TV show or in uniform on the field) only feeds the hunger to remain there. He will show up come game time.

[Kazkal]

OK, I just want to make sure I got all the latest down:

1. Chad has "lost the hunger" 'cause he's on DWTS.

2. Marvin is gone next year 'cause Mikey wont let anyone coach longer than Paul.

3. Carson Palmer is an injury-riddled has-been.

Miss anything?

August cant get here fast enough...

Well, there's the one where Mikey's cornering the market on former first-round picks with bitch titties.

And gonna brake up the best Tandem of Corners in the NFL because it would be to $$$ to keep them both...who needs CB's in a pass happy nfl...

[Pidge]

Thought this was going to be about the Maccy Ds.

[COB]

Chad's ready. He'll jump offsides and run the wrong routes like the champion he is.

[TJJackson]

Chad's ready. He'll jump offsides and run the wrong routes like the champion he is.

Will he be able to match or exceed his drop total from 2009?

What about his false starts total? Looking forward to that

Will he be able to save wear and tear on his dancing legs by once again sitting on his keester and simply watch opposing cornerbacks return balls thrown to him?

Will he be able to make time for his boxing?

Enquiring minds, and all that

[walzav29]

You guys are proving my point. Drops, false starts, and Dancing are all things he could work on. Remember when Chad used to sleep at the facilities? Remember he said he wanted to be the next Jerry Rice? Even Deion Sanders couldn't shut Rice down. The whole point is that he doesn't have the edge that he used to. I don't see how that can be argued.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

You guys are proving my point. Drops, false starts, and Dancing are all things he could work on. Remember when Chad used to sleep at the facilities? Remember he said he wanted to be the next Jerry Rice? Even Deion Sanders couldn't shut Rice down. The whole point is that he doesn't have the edge that he used to. I don't see how that can be argued.

Again, all symbolic. So he's not publically claiming he wants to be Jerry Rice? It's probably because he's older and more mature and he's defined his role with the team. He used to sleep at the team facilities? Really, in May? I wouldn't doubt that he ends up pulling some long nights again. But if he doesn't, maybe because he's getting an earlier start on the day so he doesn't need to.

He's older, more mature - by Chad's standards, anyway. Let's see what he looks like come training camp. Until then, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt.

[HairOnFire]

I will say that even though the passing game was forced to Chad and opposing defenses knowing where it was going, he still managed to put up another 1000 yard receiving season with 9 TD's at 14.5 per catch. While I won't go all in with calling that special, I won't discredit the season he had either.

I'm not trying to discredit the season he had. I'm trying to put it in perspective, and I start by asking myself what type of production should be expected after acknowledging how often the Bengals passing game was "forced" in Chad's direction.

The point to my post was simply that the additions this team made will certainly go a long way to Chad having a better 2010 and I think the thought of him losing hunger is just a bit overstated with the reasoning given.

Ignoring the hunger pangs, my question is if Chad is even capable of having a better statistical season than last year, improved supporting cast aside. I'll even argue that this offense won't get measuarably better until the talent surrounding Chad is no longer used mostly as support pieces. Simply put, traditional complimentary positions have to become stand alone roles who are measured by their own individual production....not for their ability to prop up the best remaining player from recent glory days.

As for Chad himself, I've got few problems with him remaining the #1 option as long as he reduces his rate of penalties and dropped passes. And most importantly the interception rate when throwing his direction has to be vastly reduced. Because as last year proved, Chad may still be the most productive receiver the Bengals have, but the success rate when throwing his way has fallen dramatically, and has done so in ways that Chad is both directly and individually responsible for.

[HairOnFire]

IMO Chad hasn't lost s**t.

Perhaps, but if you recall the interview he gave Dan Patrick prior to the Super Bowl, Chad spoke at length about a loss of quickness, not pure speed, being the greatest threat to his ability to continue playing. He went on to explain how he no longer attempted to beat defenders with speed or quickness, but rather...by reading the defense pre-snap, determining where he needed to be, and then attempting to beat defenders to that spot.

All of which neatly explains why Chad now draws a ridiculous number of pre-snap penalties, why he has so much trouble defeating zone coverages specifically designed to take away areas of the field, and why so many passes thrown his direction are now contested, dropped, or worse....picked off.

So yeah, I'm gonna guess that if Chad hasn't actually lost anything....there are plenty of warning signs suggesting things have started to slip....including his WR ranking, falling from Top 5 elite status in 2005 and before, to the fumble prone and footstep hearing slip in play observed in 2006 and 2007, to a bottomed out ranking of 97th in a deliberately tanked 2008, to todays propped up Top 15 mediocrity.

[ArmyBengal]

I will say that even though the passing game was forced to Chad and opposing defenses knowing where it was going, he still managed to put up another 1000 yard receiving season with 9 TD's at 14.5 per catch. While I won't go all in with calling that special, I won't discredit the season he had either.

I'm not trying to discredit the season he had. I'm trying to put it in perspective, and I start by asking myself what type of production should be expected after acknowledging how often the Bengals passing game was "forced" in Chad's direction.

The point to my post was simply that the additions this team made will certainly go a long way to Chad having a better 2010 and I think the thought of him losing hunger is just a bit overstated with the reasoning given.

Ignoring the hunger pangs, my question is if Chad is even capable of having a better statistical season than last year, improved supporting cast aside. I'll even argue that this offense won't get measuarably better until the talent surrounding Chad is no longer used mostly as support pieces. Simply put, traditional complimentary positions have to become stand alone roles who are measured by their own individual production....not for their ability to prop up the best remaining player from recent glory days.

As for Chad himself, I've got few problems with him remaining the #1 option as long as he reduces his rate of penalties and dropped passes. And most importantly the interception rate when throwing his direction has to be vastly reduced. Because as last year proved, Chad may still be the most productive receiver the Bengals have, but the success rate when throwing his way has fallen dramatically, and has done so in ways that Chad is both directly and individually responsible for.

I'm cool with all that...

If they were to reduce his role, making others that should be here longer get more involved, I wouldn't have any issues at all.

Well, that might have something to do with the fact I still believe he should have been traded when we had the chance.

[HoosierCat]

So yeah, I'm gonna guess that if Chad hasn't actually lost anything....there are plenty of warning signs suggesting things have started to slip....

Well, yes. That's been clear since, oh, about 2007. Chad had clearly lost a step, and in the years since we've seen Father Time catch up with him in a series of injuries that have hampered his performance, and in turn led to many of the issues you cite. This is one big reason why folks like me have been calling for the Bengals to pay attention to the WR position.

The poster around here you really need to explain this to is HairOnFire, who just a few threads back was strenuously arguing that the Bengals are set at WR and are just wasting picks on the position in the draft...

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

And most importantly the interception rate when throwing his direction has to be vastly reduced.

That will take care of itself, I believe. Last year Carson forced the ball at Chad in all critical situations whether he was open or not, simply because nobody else could make a play. You force the ball, you get picks. Now they have receivers who better be able to make a play in those situations.

If I have a complaint with Chad on picks, it's that Chad does a bad job playing DB on bad throws because he's sort of a wuss.

[HairOnFire]

So yeah, I'm gonna guess that if Chad hasn't actually lost anything....there are plenty of warning signs suggesting things have started to slip....

Well, yes. That's been clear since, oh, about 2007. Chad had clearly lost a step, and in the years since we've seen Father Time catch up with him in a series of injuries that have hampered his performance, and in turn led to many of the issues you cite.

So we agree. Or rather, you agree with the things I've claimed, and you now offer your voice in support. Props and kudos to me.

However....(yawn)

This is one big reason why folks like me have been calling for the Bengals to pay attention to the WR position.

Can you honestly claim they haven't?

The poster around here you really need to explain this to is HairOnFire, who just a few threads back was strenuously arguing that the Bengals are set at WR and are just wasting picks on the position in the draft...

Can you honestly argue they haven't wasted picks on WR's in the draft?

Furthermore, can you honestly claim a team that goes eleventy deep at WR isn't set at WR?

Or for that matter, that the receiving corp wasn't already much improved prior to the last round of luxury picks?

Bottom Line: You've got far more explaining to do than I.

[HairOnFire]

And most importantly the interception rate when throwing his direction has to be vastly reduced.

That will take care of itself, I believe. Last year Carson forced the ball at Chad in all critical situations whether he was open or not, simply because nobody else could make a play. You force the ball, you get picks. Now they have receivers who better be able to make a play in those situations.

Agreed, but I say take it a step further by immediately using the other skill positions as primary weapons rather than the past strategy of relegating other positions to supporting roles whose greatest value relates to how much they "open things up" for Chad. Because if healthy Antonio Bryant is probably as good as the current version of Chad, Matt Jones might be as well, they've got slot receivers falling out of their ass, incredible depth at TE...including a shiny new 1st round pick, and multiple backfield options who are receiving threats. So there can be no further talk about a shortage of weapons this year, right?

And thus, there should be no further need to force the passing game through Chad's increasingly inefficient hands. And that brings us full circle because if the Bengals don't force things through Chad....his numbers will decline. And that will be a good sign, right?

If I have a complaint with Chad on picks, it's that Chad does a bad job playing DB on bad throws because he's sort of a wuss.

The image that popped into my mind after reading the above?

Skinny arms flailing, body spinning around wildly, geeking it up....trying to draw a flag. Or start a slap fight.

[DC_Bengals_Fan]

Agreed, but I say take it a step further by immediately using the other skill positions as primary weapons rather than the past strategy of relegating other positions to supporting roles whose greatest value relates to how much they "open things up" for Chad. Because if healthy Antonio Bryant is probably as good as the current version of Chad, Matt Jones might be as well, they've got slot receivers falling out of their ass, incredible depth at TE...including a shiny new 1st round pick, and multiple backfield options who are receiving threats. So there can be no further talk about a shortage of weapons this year, right?

That's the plan. Or put another way, if the Bengals want to go anywhere, it needs to play out that way.

And thus, there should be no further need to force the passing game through Chad's increasingly inefficient hands. And that brings us full circle because if the Bengals don't force things through Chad....his numbers will decline. And that will be a good sign, right?

No doubt. This is the classic career arc of an alpha dog. Even for a player in his prime, though, forcing the ball never works. Remember the Randy Ratio? What's Mike Tice up to these days? I will say, though, Chad's total numbers may just stay the same if his decline in percentage of the offense is offset by the overall increase in offense. Rising tides raise all ships. Hopefully Chad takes it well, because as you say the days of Chad as the first, second, and only option do need to end.

Skinny arms flailing, body spinning around wildly, geeking it up....trying to draw a flag. Or start a slap fight.

Reminds one of a Eurotrash soccer player, no? That's when Chad's inner "Esteban" comes out.

[gregstephens]

So, in sum...

I agree with Hoosier's post that August can't get here fast enough. We are rehashing absolutely nothing new. Oh, and Hoos, you did forget one on your list earlier...

Will Mike Brown move the team to LA?

[HoosierCat]

Can you honestly argue they haven't wasted picks on WR's in the draft?

Depends on what you mean by "wasted." If you mean, used them on guys who turned out to suck (e.g. Jerome Simpson), yes. If you mean, wasted by using them on WRs at all, well, obviously, no.

Furthermore, can you honestly claim a team that goes eleventy deep at WR isn't set at WR?

Well, according to you we weren't set at WR because we were "eleventy deep" but because we had Chad and Bryant. Make up your mind.

Or for that matter, that the receiving corp wasn't already much improved prior to the last round of luxury picks?

It was? How? You have already admitted Chad is declining and even if Bryant is an upgrade over Coles, that's a wash. Where's the "much improved"?

Bottom Line: You've got far more explaining to do than I.

Really?

[HairOnFire]

Bottom Line: You've got far more explaining to do than I.

Really?

Poop.

[TJJackson]

Poop.

Hair, I think you need to get in to see the Doctor and get your pooper checked

Oh, and if Agreen/Gizzle offers to check it for free, beware........

[HairOnFire]

Hair, I think you need to get in to see the Doctor and get your pooper checked

Oh, and if Agreen/Gizzle offers to check it for free, beware........

Forget free. What if Hoosier offers to pay for the priviledge?

[TJJackson]

Err, if I were you, given your, uhm, history with the fellow........maybe giving him the opportunity to shove something up there that more than likely really shouldn't ever be in such a place.......I'd recommend you decline

Unless he can secure SoaG's resignation as part of the deal......then you gotta take one (both literally and figuratively) for the team

[HairOnFire]

In this very thread Walzav asked if Chad has lost the hunger. Now Chick Ludwig wonders aloud if Chad's head is still in the game. Personally, I think both of them got the question wrong, and I would ask instead if building the Ocho Cinco Brand means more to Chad than playing football.

Of course it does, right?

Anyways, here's more proof that Chick is a dink....

Is Chad’s head in the game?

Posted by cludwig May 27th, 2010, 7:22 am

From “Dancing With The Stars” to his own reality dating show on VH1 tentatively titled “The Tournament,” Chad Ochocinco is a busy man these days.

Clearly, the Bengals’ wide receiver is making plans for life after football.

Ochocinco enters his 10th NFL season this year. He turned 32 on Jan. 9. His contract runs through 2010, but the Bengals can retain him in 2011 by picking up a “club option” for $6 million.

Here are my questions for loyal “Typing Away With Chick Ludwig” readers regarding Ochocinco:

Is his head in the game (of football)?

How many more seasons can he play?

Should the Bengals let him walk after this season or should they pick up the club option for 2011?

Does he even make the 53-man roster this season?

[BengalszoneBilly]

Does he even make the 53-man roster this season?

That must be the dumbest sentence Chick has ever strung together.

[ShulaSteakhouse]

Not worried, more WR depth this year makes him less of a dependence. I think he's over the "I need all the balls going my way" part of his career, and now just wants to get to a SuperBowl and have a good season.

[BengalPimp]

Does he even make the 53-man roster this season?

That must be the dumbest sentence Chick has ever strung together.

And that's saying something......